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[quote author="AZDavidPhx" date=1248898706]irvine_home_owner -



That's right. The forums consist of mostly dumbass chatter and grabass. The real conversation is happening out on the blog.</blockquote>
I think this is shortsighted.



The forum consists of a ton of useful information and insight that is presented in a manner that blog comments can't replicate. Conversations are more easily followed here and you have the ability to post polls, videos and other useful things that can't be done in the comment section of the blogs.



I actually requested that the articles in the main blogs get crossed over into forum threads to allow a better stream of conversation. I've pulled a few of the interesting ones over in the past.



Although I can understand why you feel this way considering that it consists mainly of locals but to insult most of the posters here demonstrates how misinformed you are. I think your original comment was posted out of frustration in that other thread where you overreacted and by your responses here it seems you still harbor those feelings.



Relax... take your own advice... it's just the Internet.
 
I run across AZdavid postings alot on the blog re: Southern Ca RE. I sometimes wonder if he particpates in other RE blogs regarding various other parts of the US. If not, what interest him about So. Ca.? Yes, it might be the WTF in Ca. and so on. But why get all worked up about it? Why would a guy from AZ be so passionate about a blog in Southern Ca.



It's almost like me getting passionate about a blog regarding the RE market in Montana. I don't know if I would get so worked up about a far away RE market. Oh, well. To each his own.
 
[quote author="awgee" date=1248904112]



Sorry if I misunderstood you, but I did not assume anything. I am basing my assessment on your words.



Jealous, I dunno, but it is curious that you accuse or blame or whatever a corporate executive for manipulating prices when even the most juvenile understanding of supply and demand realizes that prices are set at the margin by buyers and sellers. and it is curious that you accuse someone you know nothing about as being a sleazeball based on your accusation. In my experience, as lacking as that may be, more is learned about the one calling names than the one being called the names. So, why is it that you resort to name calling? If not jealously, then ... ?</blockquote>


awgee -



I am not really a school teacher. That was just a cover story that I made up in order to put Dan in the awkward position of telling a school teacher that Irvine has no place for him within its community. That's why I said in my original post that I was considering calling in as "presenting myself" - keyword "presenting". Can you seriously imagine AZDavidPhx in a room with a bunch of children indoctrinating them with his corrupt anti-debt, pro-frugality, and independent crackpot views? I'd be pumping out the worst consumers the country has ever seen. Kids would shun the allowances and be asking their parents why they need such big McMansions and expensive cars when they can't afford them; AZDavid would be out of a job when all the parents called in to complain about some unamerican liberal indoctrinating children with crazy ideas. Bill O'Reilly would ambush me at the grocery store with a camera, etc. It would be a huge mess.



In regard to the Irvine Company, why don't you just ask yourself why there is such an emphasis on expensive housing? My guess is that there is not a whole lot of money to be made in the production of affordable housing. Catering to the luxury market is much more profitable. I actually have no problem with this. If the Irvine Company wants to be an exclusive club - I say "God Bless". But let's keep it real and admit that for these people to get up there and talk out both sides of the mouth and pretend that they are doing some kind of philanthropic public service and abide by a hands-off policy that makes no attempt to favor their profits is extremely disingenuous and an obvious lie.



These corporate bean-counters are all the same and they are huge benefactors of the fraud that is casino housing. It's a big game to them - how they can keep pushing profits higher and higher; squeeze more for themselves and less for you. If you want to allow them to grab your utter and squeeze - Moo for you. When the Ponzi Scheme collapses and your government goes broke because you can no longer pay the property taxes - don't go crying to me for a tax payer bailout.
 
[quote author="reason" date=1248905343]I run across AZdavid postings alot on the blog re: Southern Ca RE. I sometimes wonder if he particpates in other RE blogs regarding various other parts of the US. If not, what interest him about So. Ca.? Yes, it might be the WTF in Ca. and so on. But why get all worked up about it? Why would a guy from AZ be so passionate about a blog in Southern Ca.



It's almost like me getting passionate about a blog regarding the RE market in Montana. I don't know if I would get so worked up about a far away RE market. Oh, well. To each his own.</blockquote>


Irvine is much more interesting than Montana. It is the proud home of so many of our beloved and admired Subprime lenders that ran the country into the ground.



I am jealous that Scottsdale will not be as famous for fraudulent lending as Irvine, but I'll just have to live with that and try to cope.
 
[quote author="AZDavidPhx" date=1248909347]



In regard to the Irvine Company, why don't you just ask yourself <strong>why there is such an emphasis on expensive housing</strong>? My guess is that there is not a whole lot of money to be made in the production of affordable housing. Catering to the luxury market is much more profitable. I actually have no problem with this. If the Irvine Company wants to be an exclusive club - I say "God Bless". But let's keep it real and admit that for these people to get up there and talk out both sides of the mouth and pretend that they are doing some kind of philanthropic public service and abide by a hands-off policy that makes no attempt to favor their profits is extremely disingenuous and an obvious lie.

</blockquote>


Irvine doesn't build expensive housing. Irvine builds cheap housing that people are willing to pay a lot of money for. Sort of like designer jeans. You can go to WalMart and get a pair for maybe $10 or you can get a designer pair for over $100 even though they were probably both made at the same factory.
 
I guess blaming this whole collapse on fradulent lending is one way to look at it. Or it could be that a lot of the foreclosures were the result of greedy short-sighted homeowners like those we see profiled on the blog everyday.
 
[quote author="Oxtail" date=1248911614]I guess blaming this whole collapse on fradulent lending is one way to look at it. Or it could be that a lot of the foreclosures were the result of greedy short-sighted homeowners like those we see profiled on the blog everyday.</blockquote>


Oxtail -



Ask yourself who the rainmakers were. Who was originating the NINJA loans, forging signatures, and casually looking the other way while steering people into liar loans?



No question that the buyers were incredibly stupid and delusional with greed of their own. But these lenders were the ones filling their quotas of stinky shit mortgages to be sold back the government.



The Irvine Company is a benefactor in all of this loose credit ecstasy party. Of course the homes in Irvine were just higher class stinky shit Option-ARM loans to be sold back to the government.
 
[quote author="reason" date=1248903977]Thanks, 25inIrvine. Socal, so u're saying you listened to the recordings. Then typed it out?</blockquote>


You are correct.
 
[quote author="SoCal78" date=1248913839][quote author="reason" date=1248903977]Thanks, 25inIrvine. Socal, so u're saying you listened to the recordings. Then typed it out?</blockquote>


You are correct.</blockquote>
That's why she deserves mad props!



So... uh... maybe you could sideline as a closed caption transcriber?
 
It doesn't look like everybody is so fond of Dan....



http://www.ocweekly.com/2000-11-02/features/31-scariest-people-in-oc/2



31 Scariest People in OC

Continued from page 1

Published on November 02, 2000



9. DAN YOUNG



Among the swine feeding at the Orange County trough, Young's face is one of the most familiar. He's a senior vice president at the Irvine Co., where his responsibilities include the company's Santiago Hills II development in east Orange. That project has managed to royally infuriate locals mostly because the company turned in an environmental-impact report of unusual crappiness. But pissing off residents is nothing new for the longtime political insider. As mayor of Santa Ana in the 1980s, Young made a name for himself when he ordered that city's police department to roust the homeless from city parks; the city was successfully sued as a result. After his stint in "public service," Young cashed in as one of the principals in the consulting firm Diamond Group, later put on retainer by?surprise!?the Irvine Co. In 1996, Young snagged an $80,000 no-bid contract during the bankruptcy aftermath to study "government restructuring." His conclusion: give more power to Irvine Co. stooge and county executive officer Jan Mittermeier. MITIGATING FACTOR: Doesn't drag his knuckles on the pavement when he walks.
 
[quote author="AZDavidPhx" date=1248918052]It doesn't look like everybody is so fond of Dan....



http://www.ocweekly.com/2000-11-02/features/31-scariest-people-in-oc/2



31 Scariest People in OC

Continued from page 1

Published on November 02, 2000



9. DAN YOUNG



Among the swine feeding at the Orange County trough, Young's face is one of the most familiar. He's a senior vice president at the Irvine Co., where his responsibilities include the company's Santiago Hills II development in east Orange. That project has managed to royally infuriate locals mostly because the company turned in an environmental-impact report of unusual crappiness. But pissing off residents is nothing new for the longtime political insider. As mayor of Santa Ana in the 1980s, Young made a name for himself when he ordered that city's police department to roust the homeless from city parks; the city was successfully sued as a result. After his stint in "public service," Young cashed in as one of the principals in the consulting firm Diamond Group, later put on retainer by?surprise!?the Irvine Co. In 1996, Young snagged an $80,000 no-bid contract during the bankruptcy aftermath to study "government restructuring." His conclusion: give more power to Irvine Co. stooge and county executive officer Jan Mittermeier. MITIGATING FACTOR: Doesn't drag his knuckles on the pavement when he walks.</blockquote>


bla bla bla... I'm not listening... bla bla bla... Irvine is great, I love the perfect Irvine bubble... bla bla bla
 
[quote author="roundcorners" date=1248920845]bla bla bla... I'm not listening... bla bla bla... Irvine is great, I love the perfect Irvine bubble... bla bla bla</blockquote>
Stop reading my mind.



Calling someone you don't really know a sleazebag is pretty low... but then again... I'm a serial killer.
 
[quote author="SoCal78" date=1248913839][quote author="reason" date=1248903977]Thanks, 25inIrvine. Socal, so u're saying you listened to the recordings. Then typed it out?</blockquote>


You are correct.</blockquote>


Oh, my....Had I known that. I would have just asked for an abbreviated version. Again, thank u so much.
 
[quote author="AZDavidPhx" date=1248910357][quote author="reason" date=1248905343]I run across AZdavid postings alot on the blog re: Southern Ca RE. I sometimes wonder if he particpates in other RE blogs regarding various other parts of the US. If not, what interest him about So. Ca.? Yes, it might be the WTF in Ca. and so on. But why get all worked up about it? Why would a guy from AZ be so passionate about a blog in Southern Ca.



It's almost like me getting passionate about a blog regarding the RE market in Montana. I don't know if I would get so worked up about a far away RE market. Oh, well. To each his own.</blockquote>


Irvine is much more interesting than Montana. It is the proud home of so many of our beloved and admired Subprime lenders that ran the country into the ground.



I am jealous that Scottsdale will not be as famous for fraudulent lending as Irvine, but I'll just have to live with that and try to cope.</blockquote>


Thank you for replying. And without getting into a debate with others, I will have to agree with you that TIC do control the pricing. Ok, fine. Let me just say alittle regarding this. Yes, sometimes it's market driven. But when a company owns the land and halt the built out of new communities during market downturn. They do have a certain degree of control on pricing.



And while TIC enjoy this power of owning the land. Other builders and new communities outside of Irvine had to keep building during the last 2 years. Examples are City Place, Stadium Lofts, Harbor Lofts, Riverbend in Orange and many others. And unlike TIC whom halted the built out of OH, Stonegate, Laguna Crossing, Portola Springs, Woodbury, etc. All these outside new communities saw their prices plummeted.





And for Dan to say, "Oh, we didn't stop building. We had 22 models out in PS. They just sat there. So we stop building". There was no market demand. Sure, there was no market demand for other new communities outside of Irvine (but w/in OC) too. But since they didn't own the land, they'd to keep building and saw prices went into the gutter.
 
And if it's market driven like Dan said. Then build out all those anticipated communities such as OH, LC, PS, Woodbury, etc. And lets see where the market of the last 2 years will take the pricing. Yes, downward. But TIC halted the build out. Why? to protect the pricing.



Hey, I have said on another thread. TIC like any companies, looks out for their bottom line. So it's not wrong for them to do this. But don't say it's market driven when you own the land and step on the brakes on the build out. That is not market driven. That's company driven.
 
While I admire Dan for taking the time out of busy schedule to talk to us here on IHB. I am sure he's a smart man. And of course, I respect his experience. But please don't talk to us as if we're numbskulls.
 
That's not really a fair argument. That's like saying GM is controlling the price of cars by massively cutting production when demand tanks.
 
[quote author="Oxtail" date=1248928716]That's not really a fair argument. That's like saying GM is controlling the price of cars by massively cutting production when demand tanks.</blockquote>


Are we comparing the same thing? If we're talking about cars. Consumers might choose one over another due to qualities. When it comes to homes. Do consumers often choose the quality of one home over another? Do most consumers even know the quality of homes? Maybe Bk. But not many.
 
We have all seen the market took the prices of new homes downward in the last 2 years. It's just too much of a coincident that TIC stopped building the newer communities. If there was a market demand, why did they stop building? To protect the pricing.



Like I said, if truly the market control the prices of new homes in Irvine. Lets build them and allow the market to determine the prices. You really think the prices will go skyward?
 
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