President Trump

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Oh, didn't you hear?  Trump's foreign policy is in a shambles and his rhetoric is unprecedented.

Now close your eyes and ignore that:

1. ISIS is dying.
2. N Korea is backing down.
3. Iran is realizing we won't tolerate nukes.
4. China is caving to Trump's economic leverage.
5. Sponsors of terror like Qatar are being isolated by their neighbors.
6. Russia is losing power over Eastern Europe thanks to US oil exports.

Bonus:  No wars started yet!
 
So as it turns out, the Obama Administration had Trump Tower wiretapped.  Remember how indignant the media was when Trump first suggested this?

Exclusive: US government wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman

Washington (CNN)US investigators wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort under secret court orders before and after the election, sources tell CNN, an extraordinary step involving a high-ranking campaign official now at the center of the Russia meddling probe.

The government snooping continued into early this year, including a period when Manafort was known to talk to President Donald Trump.

Some of the intelligence collected includes communications that sparked concerns among investigators that Manafort had encouraged the Russians to help with the campaign, according to three sources familiar with the investigation. Two of these sources, however, cautioned that the evidence is not conclusive.

Special counsel Robert Mueller's team, which is leading the investigation into Russia's involvement in the election, has been provided details of these communications.

A secret order authorized by the court that handles the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) began after Manafort became the subject of an FBI investigation that began in 2014. It centered on work done by a group of Washington consulting firms for Ukraine's former ruling party, the sources told CNN.

The surveillance was discontinued at some point last year for lack of evidence, according to one of the sources.

The FBI then restarted the surveillance after obtaining a new FISA warrant that extended at least into early this year.

Sources say the second warrant was part of the FBI's efforts to investigate ties between Trump campaign associates and suspected Russian operatives. Such warrants require the approval of top Justice Department and FBI officials, and the FBI must provide the court with information showing suspicion that the subject of the warrant may be acting as an agent of a foreign power.

The court that oversees government snooping under FISA operates in secret, the surveillance so intrusive that the existence of the warrants only rarely become public.

For that reason, speculation has run rampant about whether Manafort or others associated with Trump were under surveillance. The President himself fueled the speculation when in March he used his Twitter account to accuse former President Barack Obama of having his "wires tapped" in Trump Tower.

The Justice Department and the FBI have denied that Trump's own "wires" were tapped.

While Manafort has a residence in Trump Tower, it's unclear whether FBI surveillance of him took place there.
Click to expand...

Yeah, because the FBI would never bother listening to his conversations in Trump Tower.  What would they gain by doing that?
 
Remember When James Clapper Categorically Denied Any Wiretap Against Trump Campaign?

TODD: Yeah, I was just going to say, if the F.B.I., for instance, had a FISA court order of some sort for a surveillance, would that be information you would know or not know?

CLAPPER:  Yes.

TODD:  You would be told this?

CLAPPER:  I would know that.

TODD:  If there was a FISA court order?

CLAPPER:  Yes.

TODD:  ?on something like this.

CLAPPER:  Something like this, absolutely.

TODD:  And at this point, you can?t confirm or deny whether that exists?

CLAPPER:  I can deny it.

Now we learn that there was, in fact, a FISA court order and it came from the FBI and Clapper, in his own words, claimed he would have known about that. And he denied it, unequivocally.  Maybe he forgot all about the FISA order wiretapping Paul Manafort while he was in direct contact with Trump in his campaign and after the election.

https://www.mediaite.com/columnists/remember-when-james-clapper-categorically-denied-any-wiretap-against-trump-campaign/
 

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I don't think people care. (Maybe they do)
Let's face it. People are throwing their hands in the air. (Both sides)
For example: Paris agreement (back out, now really reconsidering to get back in)
DACA (announced ending it, meeting with democrats to bringing it back)



Liar Loan said:
So as it turns out, the Obama Administration had Trump Tower wiretapped.  Remember how indignant the media was when Trump first suggested this?

Exclusive: US government wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman

Washington (CNN)US investigators wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort under secret court orders before and after the election, sources tell CNN, an extraordinary step involving a high-ranking campaign official now at the center of the Russia meddling probe.

The government snooping continued into early this year, including a period when Manafort was known to talk to President Donald Trump.

Some of the intelligence collected includes communications that sparked concerns among investigators that Manafort had encouraged the Russians to help with the campaign, according to three sources familiar with the investigation. Two of these sources, however, cautioned that the evidence is not conclusive.

Special counsel Robert Mueller's team, which is leading the investigation into Russia's involvement in the election, has been provided details of these communications.

A secret order authorized by the court that handles the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) began after Manafort became the subject of an FBI investigation that began in 2014. It centered on work done by a group of Washington consulting firms for Ukraine's former ruling party, the sources told CNN.

The surveillance was discontinued at some point last year for lack of evidence, according to one of the sources.

The FBI then restarted the surveillance after obtaining a new FISA warrant that extended at least into early this year.

Sources say the second warrant was part of the FBI's efforts to investigate ties between Trump campaign associates and suspected Russian operatives. Such warrants require the approval of top Justice Department and FBI officials, and the FBI must provide the court with information showing suspicion that the subject of the warrant may be acting as an agent of a foreign power.

The court that oversees government snooping under FISA operates in secret, the surveillance so intrusive that the existence of the warrants only rarely become public.

For that reason, speculation has run rampant about whether Manafort or others associated with Trump were under surveillance. The President himself fueled the speculation when in March he used his Twitter account to accuse former President Barack Obama of having his "wires tapped" in Trump Tower.

The Justice Department and the FBI have denied that Trump's own "wires" were tapped.

While Manafort has a residence in Trump Tower, it's unclear whether FBI surveillance of him took place there.
Click to expand...

Yeah, because the FBI would never bother listening to his conversations in Trump Tower.  What would they gain by doing that?
Click to expand...
 
This is what I think people don't get.  Trump is not an idealist. He uses all these things to bludgeon out a deal.  DACA wasn't a bargaining chip till he cancelled it. Now, he can negotiate something for it.  Paris agreement, Iran agreement, The wall...all these things are negotiable, but for better terms or they are totally cancelled.  It's his management style.  Goad the other side or even your own side publicly (Sessions or the GOP) until they do what you want.
 
morekaos said:
This is what I think people don't get.  Trump is not an idealist. He uses all these things to bludgeon out a deal.  DACA wasn't a bargaining chip till he cancelled it. Now, he can negotiate something for it.  Paris agreement, Iran agreement, The wall...all these things are negotiable, but for better terms or they are totally cancelled.  It's his management style.  Goad the other side or even your own side publicly (Sessions or the GOP) until they do what you want.
Click to expand...

Yes, this is an excellent explanation.  It also applies to the N. Korea standoff.  First China was our best friend, now they aren't doing enough to keep Kim in check.
 
It's more like changing his mind after he sees the reaction on the news.

Just remember reducing the tax itemized deductions is on the table for the new tax reform plan.

Let's see what happens.

morekaos said:
This is what I think people don't get.  Trump is not an idealist. He uses all these things to bludgeon out a deal.  DACA wasn't a bargaining chip till he cancelled it. Now, he can negotiate something for it.  Paris agreement, Iran agreement, The wall...all these things are negotiable, but for better terms or they are totally cancelled.  It's his management style.  Goad the other side or even your own side publicly (Sessions or the GOP) until they do what you want.
Click to expand...
 
I don't think so, did you not see that speech today in front of the UN? Do you really think this is a guy who gives a rats about what people think ?
 
eyephone said:
I don't think people care. (Maybe they do)
Click to expand...

Maybe more people should care.  Trump was not the only one being spied on by the Obama administration.

There were also members of Congress, as well as journalists that were being wire tapped during Obama's presidency.

Does this worry anybody?

It looks like Obama did spy on Trump, just as he apparently did to me

Nobody wants our intel agencies to be used like the Stasi in East Germany; the secret police spying on its own citizens for political purposes. The prospect of our own NSA, CIA and FBI becoming politically weaponized has been shrouded by untruths, accusations and justifications.

You?ll recall DNI Clapper falsely assured Congress in 2013 that the NSA was not collecting ?any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans.?

Intel agencies secretly monitored conversations of members of Congress while the Obama administration negotiated the Iran nuclear deal.

In 2014, the CIA got caught spying on Senate Intelligence Committee staffers, though CIA Director John Brennan had explicitly denied that.

There were also wiretaps on then-Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) in 2011 under Obama. The same happened under President George W. Bush to former Congresswoman Jane Harman (D-Calif.).

The government subsequently got caught monitoring journalists at Fox News, The Associated Press, and, as I allege in a federal lawsuit, my computers while I worked as an investigative correspondent at CBS News. On Aug. 7, 2013, CBS News publicly announced:

? correspondent Sharyl Attkisson?s computer was hacked by ?an unauthorized, external, unknown party on multiple occasions,? confirming Attkisson?s previous revelation of the hacking.

I have spent more than two years litigating against the Department of Justice for the computer intrusions. Forensics have revealed dates, times and methods of some of the illegal activities. The software used was proprietary to a federal intel agency. The intruders deployed a keystroke monitoring program, accessed the CBS News corporate computer system, listened in on my conversations by activating the computer?s microphone and used Skype to exfiltrate files.
Click to expand...
http://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/351495-it-looks-like-obama-did-spy-on-trump-just-as-he-did-to-me
 
"Former Trump Campaign Chair Paul Manafort Has Been Under FBI Surveillance For Years

Former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort has been under FBI surveillance since before the 2016 presidential election, CNN reported. The surveillance, which included wiretapping, searches, and other types of observation, reportedly began in 2014, when Manafort was the subject of an investigation into work done by a group of Washington consulting firms for the former ruling party of Ukraine."
https://www.google.com/amp/amp.time...-surveillance-donald-trump-russia/?source=dam



Liar Loan said:
eyephone said:
I don't think people care. (Maybe they do)
Click to expand...

Maybe more people should care.  Trump was not the only one being spied on by the Obama administration.

There were also members of Congress, as well as journalists that were being wire tapped during Obama's presidency.

Does this worry anybody?

It looks like Obama did spy on Trump, just as he apparently did to me

Nobody wants our intel agencies to be used like the Stasi in East Germany; the secret police spying on its own citizens for political purposes. The prospect of our own NSA, CIA and FBI becoming politically weaponized has been shrouded by untruths, accusations and justifications.

You?ll recall DNI Clapper falsely assured Congress in 2013 that the NSA was not collecting ?any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans.?

Intel agencies secretly monitored conversations of members of Congress while the Obama administration negotiated the Iran nuclear deal.

In 2014, the CIA got caught spying on Senate Intelligence Committee staffers, though CIA Director John Brennan had explicitly denied that.

There were also wiretaps on then-Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) in 2011 under Obama. The same happened under President George W. Bush to former Congresswoman Jane Harman (D-Calif.).

The government subsequently got caught monitoring journalists at Fox News, The Associated Press, and, as I allege in a federal lawsuit, my computers while I worked as an investigative correspondent at CBS News. On Aug. 7, 2013, CBS News publicly announced:

? correspondent Sharyl Attkisson?s computer was hacked by ?an unauthorized, external, unknown party on multiple occasions,? confirming Attkisson?s previous revelation of the hacking.

I have spent more than two years litigating against the Department of Justice for the computer intrusions. Forensics have revealed dates, times and methods of some of the illegal activities. The software used was proprietary to a federal intel agency. The intruders deployed a keystroke monitoring program, accessed the CBS News corporate computer system, listened in on my conversations by activating the computer?s microphone and used Skype to exfiltrate files.
Click to expand...
http://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/351495-it-looks-like-obama-did-spy-on-trump-just-as-he-did-to-me
Click to expand...
 
eyephone said:
Former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort has been under FBI surveillance since before the 2016 presidential election, CNN reported.
Click to expand...

This is not exactly correct.  He was no longer under surveillance when he became Trump's campaign manager.  In order to get surveillance renewed by the court, the FBI has to show cause, which apparently they didn't have.  When they tried to renew surveillance in 2016 during the campaign, it was at first rejected by the court.  The scope of the request was then changed and they received a more narrow warrant then they originally sought.  In all likelihood, the fake Trump dossier is what was used as justification for the second warrant.
 
Liar Loan said:
eyephone said:
Former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort has been under FBI surveillance since before the 2016 presidential election, CNN reported.
Click to expand...

This is not exactly correct.  He was no longer under surveillance when he became Trump's campaign manager.  In order to get surveillance renewed by the court, the FBI has to show cause, which apparently they didn't have.  When they tried to renew surveillance in 2016 during the campaign, it was at first rejected by the court.  The scope of the request was then changed and they received a more narrow warrant then they originally sought.  In all likelihood, the fake Trump dossier is what was used as justification for the second warrant.
Click to expand...

Again. I don't think people are concerned. Since he was under the radar previously by the government, according to the article mentioned previously.
 
Manafort doesn't seem very concerned...if there was anything to really see why would he want them to release all the tapes? Beyond proving that Trump was on some of them and thus vindicating him, there doesn't seem to be much there there.

Paul Manafort wants transcripts of his surveilled conversations released

?Mr. Manafort requests that the Department of Justice release any intercepts involving him and any non-Americans so interested parties can come to the same conclusion as the DOJ ? there is nothing there,? his statement said.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/manafort-transcripts-conversations-released-article-1.3507084
 
It just comes out of my mouth that way...
>:D

Wiretaps may prove Trump right ? and that?s absolutely terrifying

If so, that would mark an infamous history ? an American president being overheard by secret agents of his own government.
It would also be additional support for Trump?s charge that former President Barack Obama ?had my ?wires tapped? in Trump Tower just before the victory.?

It was in March when Trump made that explosive claim, and the Democratic media rushed to denounce him even before Obama did. Subsequent denials from then-FBI boss James Comey and other Obama aides all were rock-solid in declaring that no such thing had happened. There was no wiggle room in their denials, some of which were made under oath before Congress.

But something certainly happened. And what if it was the worst imaginable something? What if the Republican candidate for president was put under surveillance by a Democratic administration that was trying to elect another Democrat?

http://nypost.com/2017/09/19/wiretaps-may-prove-trump-right-and-thats-absolutely-terrifying/
 
morekaos said:
Remember When James Clapper Categorically Denied Any Wiretap Against Trump Campaign?

TODD: Yeah, I was just going to say, if the F.B.I., for instance, had a FISA court order of some sort for a surveillance, would that be information you would know or not know?

CLAPPER:  Yes.

TODD:  You would be told this?

CLAPPER:  I would know that.

TODD:  If there was a FISA court order?

CLAPPER:  Yes.

TODD:  ?on something like this.

CLAPPER:  Something like this, absolutely.

TODD:  And at this point, you can?t confirm or deny whether that exists?

CLAPPER:  I can deny it.

Now we learn that there was, in fact, a FISA court order and it came from the FBI and Clapper, in his own words, claimed he would have known about that. And he denied it, unequivocally.  Maybe he forgot all about the FISA order wiretapping Paul Manafort while he was in direct contact with Trump in his campaign and after the election.

https://www.mediaite.com/columnists/remember-when-james-clapper-categorically-denied-any-wiretap-against-trump-campaign/
Click to expand...

Then and now...

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Is it possible the president was picked up in a conversation with Paul Manafort?

JAMES CLAPPER, FORMER DNI: It's certainly conceivable.

LEMON: Is it likely?

CLAPPER: I can't say. I wouldn't want to go there, but I will say it's possible.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/09/21/clapper_possible_that_trump_was_recorded_on_manafort_wiretap_conceivable.html
 
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