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lovingit said:
Kuzma!  I like this kid.
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What if you're a Pacer fan knowing you could've had Kuzma and Hart in the PG13 talks, but instead have Oladipo on a crazy contract? Burn. Thanks Larry Bird. At least you kept PG13 from the Lakers for a few months...
 
Perspective said:
lovingit said:
Kuzma!  I like this kid.
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What if you're a Pacer fan knowing you could've had Kuzma and Hart in the PG13 talks, but instead have Oladipo on a crazy contract? Burn. Thanks Larry Bird. At least you kept PG13 from the Lakers for a few months...
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Ball is making Kuzma better. Funny thing is that the Pacers picked Leaf. Lol. Suckers
 
irvinehomeowner said:
2 injuries in just over a week of play?

What's going to happen during the regular season when the competition is much tougher?
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The first one he would just continue to play.  Wouldn't be much of an issue.

This one would probably set him back a game or two.  He's been playing a lot.
 
irvinehomeowner said:
Both of those injuries are problematic as they can keep reoccurring.

I don't remember him being injury prone during his 1 year at UCLA.
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Maybe Lavar's training program  needs to include Yoga.
 
For argument's sake, if you were to remove Lonzo's first summer league game from existence, he shot 43% from the field.  Not great, but not awful.  I think the nerves/pressure was too much for him in that first game b/c of the hype machine. 

He looked more comfortable on the court in all his other games, including the game he shot 6 for 20.  While his shooting is somewhat of an issue, it's his on-ball defense that should concern Laker fans. 

I would be pleased if he can shoot 43% during the regular season.  Jason Kidd only did that one season his entire career -- his first four years, he shot 39%, 38%, 40%, and 37%. 
 
paydawg said:
For argument's sake, if you were to remove Lonzo's first summer league game from existence, he shot 43% from the field.  Not great, but not awful.  I think the nerves/pressure was too much for him in that first game b/c of the hype machine. 

He looked more comfortable on the court in all his other games, including the game he shot 6 for 20.  While his shooting is somewhat of an issue, it's his on-ball defense that should concern Laker fans. 

I would be pleased if he can shoot 43% during the regular season.  Jason Kidd only did that one season his entire career -- his first four years, he shot 39%, 38%, 40%, and 37%.
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Agreed, but we knew he wouldn't be a stout defensive player. We're hoping his length allows him to overcome his slow feet on D. This is another reason the DLo trade didn't upset me much. Can you imagine the Laker backcourt D with DLo and Ball??? Long story short, Ball is no worse defensively than DLo is. That's a wash.
 
Perspective said:
paydawg said:
For argument's sake, if you were to remove Lonzo's first summer league game from existence, he shot 43% from the field.  Not great, but not awful.  I think the nerves/pressure was too much for him in that first game b/c of the hype machine. 

He looked more comfortable on the court in all his other games, including the game he shot 6 for 20.  While his shooting is somewhat of an issue, it's his on-ball defense that should concern Laker fans. 

I would be pleased if he can shoot 43% during the regular season.  Jason Kidd only did that one season his entire career -- his first four years, he shot 39%, 38%, 40%, and 37%.
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Agreed, but we knew he wouldn't be a stout defensive player. We're hoping his length allows him to overcome his slow feet on D. This is another reason the DLo trade didn't upset me much. Can you imagine the Laker backcourt D with DLo and Ball??? Long story short, Ball is no worse defensively than DLo is. That's a wash.
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what do you consider Lonzo's upside and downside?  For the upside, I'm thinking a better shooting version of Jason Kidd.  For downside, I see a poor man's Rajan Rondo.  if he ends up closer to Rondo than Kidd, is he worthy of the #2 pick?  Time will tell. 

I'm curious to see who the comparables to Kuzma are.  Shawn Marion maybe?
 
paydawg said:
Perspective said:
paydawg said:
For argument's sake, if you were to remove Lonzo's first summer league game from existence, he shot 43% from the field.  Not great, but not awful.  I think the nerves/pressure was too much for him in that first game b/c of the hype machine. 

He looked more comfortable on the court in all his other games, including the game he shot 6 for 20.  While his shooting is somewhat of an issue, it's his on-ball defense that should concern Laker fans. 

I would be pleased if he can shoot 43% during the regular season.  Jason Kidd only did that one season his entire career -- his first four years, he shot 39%, 38%, 40%, and 37%.
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Agreed, but we knew he wouldn't be a stout defensive player. We're hoping his length allows him to overcome his slow feet on D. This is another reason the DLo trade didn't upset me much. Can you imagine the Laker backcourt D with DLo and Ball??? Long story short, Ball is no worse defensively than DLo is. That's a wash.
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what do you consider Lonzo's upside and downside?  For the upside, I'm thinking a better shooting version of Jason Kidd.  For downside, I see a poor man's Rajan Rondo.  if he ends up closer to Rondo than Kidd, is he worthy of the #2 pick?  Time will tell. 

I'm curious to see who the comparables to Kuzma are.  Shawn Marion maybe?
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His upside will be the midrange game. Downside is the defensive liability.

Ronda was good at passing but never made his team better by doing so. Rondo couldn't hit a three either. Kobe used to just guard the guy in the post and dared him to shoot.

 
A better shooting Kidd comp is probably the best one. Rondo was a decent distributor on the Celtic contending teams, but he was an awesome defensive player before the knee injury and aging. I don't think we should correlate Ball and Rondo's games.

A worst case scenario comp is hard to find, probably because there are so few basketball players with this type of court vision and passing execution.

Let's not get too hung-up on D either. James Harden hasn't played any D for years, and he was an MVP candidate last season. Curry's a pretty bad defensive player too. You just need players who compliment these types of guys, because they do so many other things so well.
 
Perspective said:
A better shooting Kidd comp is probably the best one. Rondo was a decent distributor on the Celtic contending teams, but he was an awesome defensive player before the knee injury and aging. I don't think we should correlate Ball and Rondo's games.

A worst case scenario comp is hard to find, probably because there are so few basketball players with this type of court vision and passing execution.

Let's not get too hung-up on D either. James Harden hasn't played any D for years, and he was an MVP candidate last season. Curry's a pretty bad defensive player too. You just need players who compliment these types of guys, because they do so many other things so well.
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Curry and Nash come to mind for bad defense.  Harden could d it up.. but he doesn't want to waste his energy as he'd rather use it to make shots and do that dumb chef eating dance. 
 
The optics on identifying defense are actually hard.

I play quite a bit of fantasy basketball, and Harden actually has lots of steals and blocks. It's his one-on-one defense that isn't so hot but his help defense is actually pretty good.

That's similar to what I see in Ball, he can intercept passes and gets help blocks.

Curry is the same thing... gets steals but just not on his own man.

Defense is really a big man trait because guards/wings are going to get their buckets regardless... has anyone really ever locked down the high scoring players?
 
irvinehomeowner said:
The optics on identifying defense are actually hard.

I play quite a bit of fantasy basketball, and Harden actually has lots of steals and blocks. It's his one-on-one defense that isn't so hot but his help defense is actually pretty good.

That's similar to what I see in Ball, he can intercept passes and gets help blocks.

Curry is the same thing... gets steals but just not on his own man.

Defense is really a big man trait because guards/wings are going to get their buckets regardless... has anyone really ever locked down the high scoring players?
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Also, summer league being summer league.. the help defense is terrible.  At one point in the game last night, I think three straight plays, the Laker players didn't know who to guard and one guy was always open. 
 
paydawg said:
Lonzo out for tonight's game.  Guess next time we'll see him is in the pre-season games.
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Wonder if Lakers will unleash Ingram to win the SL championship  8)

Ball's best offensive comp is probably kidd.  He doesn't pound the ball like cp3/rondo and gets it out of his hands as quick as possible.  Defensively, Kidd was a beast defensively (man d as well) so that's unfair.  He'll probably end up around Nash/cp3 level/curry defensively.  He'll have a good steal/block rate, but it'll be off the ball like others have mentioned.  He actually anticipates passes really well, might even be elite based on what I've seen. 

Kuzma.  I'm seeing young Robert horry type game.  A bit of draymond in terms of versatility.  Maybe a little odom without the handle.  But he'll fit right in with Luke's position-less team.  I like the pick.  He probably should've been a top 15 pick (compares well with tatum's SL stats) ..maybe it's the lonzo effect.  Maybe TJ leaf won't be as good as anticipated since he's not with Lonzo anymore. Or maybe Kuzma is legit on his own. 

I saw our team almost lose that 20 point lead with Lonzo off the floor. His impact on/off is incredible.  He's going to make our legit nba talent like  Lopez/Randle/Clarkson look even better like he has with all our d league talent.  Guys I'm feeling more confident in my playoff prediction.  He's special!  8)   
 
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