ICE or EV?

Which car(s) will you be buying next?

  • ICE ICE Baby (morekaos dinosaur option)

    Votes: 13 31.0%

  • EV forEVa (unicorns for all)

    Votes: 23 54.8%

  • PHEV (I still have range anxiety)

    Votes: 4 9.5%

  • Hybrid (can't plug in yet)

    Votes: 5 11.9%

  • Alternative fuel (Hydrogen, vegetable oil, etc)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Other

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • Total voters
    42
NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
Everyone who wanted one has one …hope is a terrible business plan...😂😂😂😂

Ford pushes back EV target, warns of wider losses due to slower-than-expected adoption​

  • Ford now expects to be building EVs at a rate of 600,000 per year sometime during 2024, a delay from earlier estimates that it would reach that level by the end of 2023.
  • Ford also said it now expects its EV business unit, Ford Model e, to post an operating loss of about $4.5 billion this year.
  • In a statement, CEO Jim Farley argued that the more gradual ramp-up of electric vehicle production could be a boon for Ford.
www.cnbc.com

Ford pushes back EV target, warns of wider losses due to slower-than-expected adoption

Ford said it now expects its EV business unit, Ford Model e, to post an operating loss of about $4.5 billion this year
www.cnbc.com www.cnbc.com
 
Umm, not really, people still wants EV's. Fear seems to be your business plan

"Tesla came out as the car brand people are looking to buy the most across the world, topping the tables as the most Googled car for sale in 39 countries. It came first in the USA (in 25 of the 50 states, see appendix below), as well as Canada, France, Spain, Germany, Australia, UAE and Scandinavia."


world-map.png

Summary​

Consumers are continuing to travel less than in pre-COVID-19 times, but their preference for the car – and electric vehicles in particular – is growing stronger.

www.ey.com

Why consumers are charging toward electric vehicles

The top motivator in EV sales remains environmental concern, while penalties with ICE vehicles and EV incentives emerge. Learn more.
www.ey.com www.ey.com
 
Not me saying it…Ford is not alone is slacking demand…🤷🏽‍♂️😂😂😂

Tesla inventory, order backlog data signal a worrying demand picture​

Despite blowout delivery numbers for Q2, new data may be pointing to a demand problem for Tesla (TSLA).

The latest data from Matt Jung, who closely tracks Tesla data, shows US inventories for new Tesla models — including the S, 3, X, and Y — have been increasing in recent weeks, reaching 2,757 as of July 19.

A large buildup in inventory suggests Tesla could be upping its production volumes or is having a harder time selling new inventory.

With demand seeming to slip, however, Tesla may have to resort to more price cuts to gin up demand or decrease output.

www.aol.com

Tesla inventory, order backlog data signal a worrying demand picture

Despite blowout delivery numbers for Q2, new data may be pointing to a demand problem for Tesla.
www.aol.com www.aol.com
 
No one is immune…🤦🏽‍♂️😂😂😂

VW electric car sales “fall to zero” as Tesla and China EV makers win price war​

Volkswagen’s domestic sales of electric cars in Germany are far behind the company’s plans, insiders told business daily Handelsblatt.
Executives at some VW plants said demand for particular battery-electric models had fallen “to zero,” while car dealers pointed to a general reluctance of European consumers to buy electric cars, blaming subsidy cuts, high inflation and comparatively high prices.

thedriven.io

VW electric car sales "fall to zero" as Tesla and China EV makers win price war

Executives at some VW plants say demand for particular battery-electric models has fallen “to zero.”
thedriven.io thedriven.io
 
Those are the companies themselves saying there is slack demand and warning shareholders…Me I Never feel bad when my people make money…how you feel about it is irrelevant.🤷🏽‍♂️
 
Really? Ford said;
Everyone who wanted one has one …hope is a terrible business plan...😂😂😂😂

And Tesla was from a post from aol.com

So higher interest rates, supply chain, inflation have nothing to do with slowing demand?

I’ve already posted before that EV as a % of sales have been increasing in all states, eventually it’ll slow, but I have yet to see a current report showing negative.

But continue to fear, to each his own
 
Another factor is now that other brands have EVs on the lot and are discounting them (instead of marking up), people have choices other than Tesla. Maybe bad for TSLA but good for EVs overall because choice is consumer friendly.

I feel this will put more downward pressure on Tesla and we make actually see a sub-$30k Tesla soon (even though morekaos won't be able to find it) and that will open up EVs to more people.

All this stuff morekaos is posting is just demonstrating the move to EVs... I mean, why would more states charge an EV registration fee unless... uh... more people are getting them?

I think it's like EVs - 173 to morekaos - 0. :)
 
The only reason states charge more taxes is because they want more tax money, period. If it moves they want to tax it, just that simple. No matter how you want to slice it, you can’t repeal the laws of supply and demand. Too much supply….low demand equals lower prices. Like I said, hope it’s not a business plan.
 
morekaos said:
The only reason states charge more taxes is because they want more tax money, period. If it moves they want to tax it, just that simple. No matter how you want to slice it, you can’t repeal the laws of supply and demand. Too much supply….low demand equals lower prices. Like I said, hope it’s not a business plan.
Click to expand...

First no one wants one, then when they want one it's too expensive, now that it's cheaper, they don't want one anymore?

Make up your mind.

EVs 174, morekaos 0
 
morekaos said:
Tell that to Ford shareholders. 🤷🏽‍♂️😂😂😂
Click to expand...
What about Tesla, because you sure did mention them. Their long time shareholders enjoyed 17000% gains.

Tell Ford Shareholders what exactly? Stop EV production? Now that’s a joke.
If their goal is going obsolete sure, but market is changing, and they sure know about that. If you were there back in the heydays, you’d be up in arms saying can’t replace the horse and carriage. Haha

First you whine and complain about the EV tax incentives and when it’s about special EV taxation, much ado about nothing? Talk about forcing your narrative.
 
Ford offers us the best and clearest warning in its pursuit of unicorns because it breaks down earnings by divisions. Economic excuses affect each division equally so sales and revenue comparisons should be fair. ICE sales (in both Blue and Pro) continue to hit records and produce ALL of the profits and revenue growth while EV (Model E) sales continue to create more and more losses with no end in sight. In fact F upped the expected losses just in that division dramatically while simultaneously reducing the production levels and moving the target out a year. I will use their own words from their earning release yesterday to prove my point. Ford shareholders suffer in the pursuit of unicorns and rainbows. Unicorns 175:Ford Shareholders 0…Read it for yourself…🤷🏽‍♂️😂😂😂

Ford Pro, Ford Blue Drive Solid Second-Quarter Results; Company Raises Expectations for Full-Year 2023 Profitability

• Revenue increases 12% year-over-year to $45 billion; net income ($1.9 billion) and adjusted EBIT ($3.8 billion) also higher; cash and liquidity persistently strong

• Appeal of Ford Pro to commercial customers produces 22% revenue growth; EBIT more than doubles to $2.4 billion, a 15% margin; software, repair services sales up

• Ford Blue gas and hybrid business posts higher wholesales and revenue, reports $2.3 billion in EBIT; all-new global Ranger pickup even more popular, profitable

• Ford Model e revenue up 39%; scaling, competitive pricing further establishing leadership ahead of industry’s next-generation EVs; now expecting to reach 600K run rate in 2024 (Was supposed to be there this year)

• Company raises full-year 2023 guidance for adjusted EBIT to between $11 billion and $12 billion, and for adjusted free cash flow to between $6.5 billion and $7 billion



• Approaching $8 billion for Ford Pro, more than double in 2022, from significant year-over year improvement in pricing and volume

• Of about $8 billion from Ford Blue, with higher volumes and stronger mix more than offsetting any potential pricing headwinds, and

• To be a loss of about $4.5 billion for Ford Model e, reflecting the pricing environment, disciplined investments in new products and capacity, and other costs.

“The near-term pace of EV adoption will be a little slower than expected

Farley said that Ford now expects to reach a 600,000-unit EV production run rate during 2024

“The transition to EVs is happening, it just may take a little longer,” CFO John Lawler said

https://mms.businesswire.com/media/20230727284277/en/1852801/1/7-27-23_Ford_Pro_Ford_Blue_Drive_Solid_Second-Quarter_Results.pdf?download=1&_gl=1*1u1jp6d*_ga*MTIwNzQ3Nzc4NS4xNjg5ODc1MjY3*_ga_ZQWF70T3FK*MTY5MDQ4ODM3MC4yLjAuMTY5MDQ4ODM3MC42MC4wLjA.
 
I know you hope and feel that way but reality hurts…🤷🏽‍♂️🤔😂😂
EV sales growth's about to slow. If building is getting easier, why is selling them harder?

“When it comes to EV sales, the market is likely heading into its Trough of Disillusionment ... where collaboration across many parties will be necessary to push through,” Cox said in a release. “Building EVs is one thing, and many in the industry are proving excellent at that skill. Selling EVs is something different altogether.”

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...les-dropping-cox-automotive-says/70411020007/

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2023/05/08/ev-sales-2023-slowing/70188358007/
 
Do you tell your clients that after a company spending billions in order to survive, expect shareholders to see positive margins by the next quarterly shareholder meeting? Basic business 101, it doesn't, R&D, capital investments all take time to turn profit. Fugazi

morekaos said:
Ford offers us the best and clearest warning in its pursuit of unicorns because it breaks down earnings by divisions. Economic excuses affect each division equally so sales and revenue comparisons should be fair. ICE sales (in both Blue and Pro) continue to hit records and produce ALL of the profits and revenue growth while EV (Model E) sales continue to create more and more losses with no end in sight. In fact F upped the expected losses just in that division dramatically while simultaneously reducing the production levels and moving the target out a year. I will use their own words from their earning release yesterday to prove my point. Ford shareholders suffer in the pursuit of unicorns and rainbows. Unicorns 175:Ford Shareholders 0…Read it for yourself…🤷🏽‍♂️😂😂😂

Ford Pro, Ford Blue Drive Solid Second-Quarter Results; Company Raises Expectations for Full-Year 2023 Profitability

• Revenue increases 12% year-over-year to $45 billion; net income ($1.9 billion) and adjusted EBIT ($3.8 billion) also higher; cash and liquidity persistently strong

• Appeal of Ford Pro to commercial customers produces 22% revenue growth; EBIT more than doubles to $2.4 billion, a 15% margin; software, repair services sales up

• Ford Blue gas and hybrid business posts higher wholesales and revenue, reports $2.3 billion in EBIT; all-new global Ranger pickup even more popular, profitable

• Ford Model e revenue up 39%; scaling, competitive pricing further establishing leadership ahead of industry’s next-generation EVs; now expecting to reach 600K run rate in 2024 (Was supposed to be there this year)

• Company raises full-year 2023 guidance for adjusted EBIT to between $11 billion and $12 billion, and for adjusted free cash flow to between $6.5 billion and $7 billion



• Approaching $8 billion for Ford Pro, more than double in 2022, from significant year-over year improvement in pricing and volume

• Of about $8 billion from Ford Blue, with higher volumes and stronger mix more than offsetting any potential pricing headwinds, and

• To be a loss of about $4.5 billion for Ford Model e, reflecting the pricing environment, disciplined investments in new products and capacity, and other costs.

“The near-term pace of EV adoption will be a little slower than expected

Farley said that Ford now expects to reach a 600,000-unit EV production run rate during 2024

“The transition to EVs is happening, it just may take a little longer,” CFO John Lawler said

https://mms.businesswire.com/media/20230727284277/en/1852801/1/7-27-23_Ford_Pro_Ford_Blue_Drive_Solid_Second-Quarter_Results.pdf?download=1&_gl=1*1u1jp6d*_ga*MTIwNzQ3Nzc4NS4xNjg5ODc1MjY3*_ga_ZQWF70T3FK*MTY5MDQ4ODM3MC4yLjAuMTY5MDQ4ODM3MC42MC4wLjA.
Click to expand...
 
morekaos said:
I know you hope and feel that way but reality hurts…🤷🏽‍♂️🤔😂😂
EV sales growth's about to slow. If building is getting easier, why is selling them harder?

“When it comes to EV sales, the market is likely heading into its Trough of Disillusionment ... where collaboration across many parties will be necessary to push through,” Cox said in a release. “Building EVs is one thing, and many in the industry are proving excellent at that skill. Selling EVs is something different altogether.”

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...les-dropping-cox-automotive-says/70411020007/

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2023/05/08/ev-sales-2023-slowing/70188358007/
Click to expand...
It sure does, reality hurts for YOU, :coffee::):censored::cautious::giggle::alien:

"Ready to charge into the future? The market for electric vehicles (EVs) has grown rapidly in recent years and is expected to continue to grow at a fast pace over the coming decade. Electric car sales in the United States increased from a mere 0.2 percent of total car sales in 2011 to 4.6 percent in 2021.1


Although forecasts for the rate of EV adoption over the next decade vary widely given rapid changes in both government policies and the auto manufacturing industry in recent years—many forecasts expect a strong acceleration in EV adoption. S&P Global Mobility forecasts electric vehicle sales in the United States could reach 40 percent of total passenger car sales by 2030, and more optimistic projections foresee electric vehicle sales surpassing 50 percent by 2030"

www.bls.gov

Charging into the future: the transition to electric vehicles : Beyond the Numbers: U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

This Beyond the Numbers article examines the main factors expected to contribute to growth in the electric vehicle market and identifies some occupations that are expected to play a role in the design and development of electric vehicles, in the manufacturing of the batteries that power them...
www.bls.gov www.bls.gov
 
wow, you may hate my sources but quoting from the bureau of labor statistics? that is funny and a direct propaganda arm of grandpa Joe’s government. Talk about biased?🤷🏽‍♂️😂😂😂🤦🏽‍♂️
 
AW said:
Do you tell your clients that after a company spending billions in order to survive, expect shareholders to see positive margins by the next quarterly shareholder meeting? Basic business 101, it doesn't, R&D, capital investments all take time to turn profit. Fugazi
Click to expand...
Survive? They’re thriving, look at their ICE sales, revenues and earnings are billions of dollars. I expect a companies management to create shareholder value not destroy equity. Concentrate on what makes people money not the foolish pursuit of unicorns and rainbows.
 
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