Harvard Admits 4.6% of Applicants; Other Ivy League Schools Get Tougher, Too

[Irvinecommuter]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

 

[Logik]

Hi,

Regarding sports, are there certain ones that seem to stand out to Ivy schools or are they simply looking for dedication to a sport.  We have a friend whose son is currently in 11th grade and about to get ready to apply to college.  He is a very competitive in jiu jitsu winning a number of championships but not sure if many folks are even familiar with the sport since it is not your typical high school sport. 

 

[lnc]

Hi,

Regarding sports, are there certain ones that seem to stand out to Ivy schools or are they simply looking for dedication to a sport.  We have a friend whose son is currently in 11th grade and about to get ready to apply to college.  He is a very competitive in jiu jitsu winning a number of championships but not sure if many folks are even familiar with the sport since it is not your typical high school sport. 

The kid should?ve try fencing.

Not sure about Ivy school admittance  nor  jiu jitsu but here?s an interesting article about type of sport and chance of getting an scholarship.  And maybe there are some similarities regarding to getting accepted

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/t...-play-to-get-a-college-scholarship-2017-05-08

 

[eyephone]

Sometimes I wonder. Is it the student or parent that want wants to go to an Ivy League school?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

Sometimes I wonder. Is it the student or parent that want wants to go to an Ivy League school?

Tiger and helicopter parents project on their kids like overbearing parents of star athletes.

 

[momopi]

Hi,
Regarding sports, are there certain ones that seem to stand out to Ivy schools or are they simply looking for dedication to a sport.  We have a friend whose son is currently in 11th grade and about to get ready to apply to college.  He is a very competitive in jiu jitsu winning a number of championships but not sure if many folks are even familiar with the sport since it is not your typical high school sport. 

The kid should?ve try fencing.

Not sure about Ivy school admittance  nor  jiu jitsu but here?s an interesting article about type of sport and chance of getting an scholarship.  And maybe there are some similarities regarding to getting accepted
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/t...-play-to-get-a-college-scholarship-2017-05-08

I did fencing (French foil) in school.  It's a much smaller world and has higher % of athletes who trained since they were young, and those who transitioned from HS teams to college teams with years of experience.  If you want your child to go to college on fencing scholarship, make sure he/she has commitment and skill.  I mean 3 hours/day, 5 days/week of practice, in addition to GPA/academic standards.

For those who got into the sport later in life (me), the skill gap is quite large.  But it's a fun sport for those who like to poke, and those who like to be poked.

 

[bones]

Hi,

Regarding sports, are there certain ones that seem to stand out to Ivy schools or are they simply looking for dedication to a sport.  We have a friend whose son is currently in 11th grade and about to get ready to apply to college.  He is a very competitive in jiu jitsu winning a number of championships but not sure if many folks are even familiar with the sport since it is not your typical high school sport. 

Like others have mentioned, its not about the sport but how you package and storytell about that sport and weave it into the overall application.

 

[eyephone]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

The student with the best grades and SAT scores and accomplishments should get in.

Unfortunately, this will go to court potentially.

 

[nosuchreality]

I disagree, SAT scores and grades should be used as a minimal bar for consideration.  Grades are too influenced by bias and SAT scores are a reflection of training to take a SAT test.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

The student with the best grades and SAT scores and accomplishments should get in.

Unfortunately, this will go to court potentially.

No...those are indication of some abilities but not all.  Plenty of medical school grads struggle as doctors because they have terrible bedside manners.  Diversity, life experience, perseverance, overcoming hardships, etc. are all worthy things to consider.

 

[eyephone]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

The student with the best grades and SAT scores and accomplishments should get in.

Unfortunately, this will go to court potentially.

No...those are indication of some abilities but not all.  Plenty of medical school grads struggle as doctors because they have terrible bedside manners.  Diversity, life experience, perseverance, overcoming hardships, etc. are all worthy things to consider.

Are you tell me you wouldn?t pick the school president with a 3.5 plus, but you will pick a person with around a 2.0 to 3.0 that has helped people in a hurricane.
(Making story up but for conversation purposes)

 

[fortune11]

Problem with just using grades and SAT is that they can be "gamed" by people working hard to optimize for that singular outcome. 

So do need a more wholistic approach.  Problem is that also leads to nepotism like the legacy admissions for privileged people and leaving out some truly deserving Asian Americans

the only logical end game is to increase supply to meet the demand -- but unlike german automakers , elite colleges are very smart at keeping number of seats limited so as not to dilute their brand and keep the alumni endowment $$ flowing in

 

[Irvinecommuter]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

The student with the best grades and SAT scores and accomplishments should get in.

Unfortunately, this will go to court potentially.

No...those are indication of some abilities but not all.  Plenty of medical school grads struggle as doctors because they have terrible bedside manners.  Diversity, life experience, perseverance, overcoming hardships, etc. are all worthy things to consider.

Are you tell me you wouldn?t pick the school president with an3.5 plus, but you will pick a person with around a 2.0 that has helped people in a hurricane.
(Making story up but for conversation purposes)

Read that again and tell me what I should even respond. 

 

[eyephone]

?Trump administration backs Asian-American students in Harvard admissions lawsuit

The Trump administration threw its weight Friday behind a student group that says Harvard University discriminates against Asian-Americans in its admissions process, urging a federal judge Friday not to keep years' worth of admissions records under wraps.

The move by the Justice Department forecasts the emerging fault lines in what could serve as the first major affirmative action case of the Trump administration.

The fight surrounding the secrecy of the Harvard's competitive admissions process stems from a 2014 lawsuit brought by Students for Fair Admissions, a nonprofit organization that argues race-conscious admissions policies are unconstitutional. The group includes over a dozen students who claim they were rejected from Harvard because the it engages in "racial balancing" by capping the number of Asian-Americans it admits each year.?

Source:https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/harvard-admissions-lawsuit/index.html

LOOK AT MY ASIAN-AMERICAN FRIENDS!

The student with the best grades and SAT scores and accomplishments should get in.

Unfortunately, this will go to court potentially.

No...those are indication of some abilities but not all.  Plenty of medical school grads struggle as doctors because they have terrible bedside manners.  Diversity, life experience, perseverance, overcoming hardships, etc. are all worthy things to consider.

Are you tell me you wouldn?t pick the school president with an3.5 plus, but you will pick a person with around a 2.0 that has helped people in a hurricane.
(Making story up but for conversation purposes)

Read that again and tell me what I should even respond.

idk. Hypothetically they can do that, right?

 

[Irvinecommuter]

idk. Hypothetically they can do that, right?

Sure and one can hypothetically win the lottery too.  If Harvard is accepting 4.5% of applicant...you really think that they are pick a person with a 2.0 GPA.

No one is saying that grades and testing are not important factors...they just should not be the sole factors, especially in a world where innovation, outside of the box thinking, and other non-academic skills are becoming more and more important. 

This lawsuit reminds me of those Confucian scholar in late Q'ing complaining about how the Imperial Court was moving away from its Confucian core and adopting "Western practices".

 

[Happiness]

Problem with just using grades and SAT is that they can be "gamed" by people working hard to optimize for that singular outcome. 

There is a decades old multi-billion dollar industry dedicated to gaming the "wholistic" approach.

 

[fortune11]

Problem with just using grades and SAT is that they can be "gamed" by people working hard to optimize for that singular outcome. 

There is a decades old multi-billion dollar industry dedicated to gaming the "wholistic" approach.

Easier to game the academic system than the wholistic one

Since those (wholistic) criteria are not as well defined and keep shifting

Again look at ? base rate ? ? which one has a meaningfully if higher probability of being gamed

 

[eyephone]

idk. Hypothetically they can do that, right?

Sure and one can hypothetically win the lottery too.  If Harvard is accepting 4.5% of applicant...you really think that they are pick a person with a 2.0 GPA.

No one is saying that grades and testing are not important factors...they just should not be the sole factors, especially in a world where innovation, outside of the box thinking, and other non-academic skills are becoming more and more important. 

This lawsuit reminds me of those Confucian scholar in late Q'ing complaining about how the Imperial Court was moving away from its Confucian core and adopting "Western practices".

If you look at my update I changed it to a 2.0 to 3.0.

The way you are describing is kind of like affirmative action with a catch. Accept a person that doesnt meet the basic requirements or accept a person that is not within the range of applicants. Therefore not considering the valedictorian of the school or student body president with great SAT scores.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

idk. Hypothetically they can do that, right?

Sure and one can hypothetically win the lottery too.  If Harvard is accepting 4.5% of applicant...you really think that they are pick a person with a 2.0 GPA.

No one is saying that grades and testing are not important factors...they just should not be the sole factors, especially in a world where innovation, outside of the box thinking, and other non-academic skills are becoming more and more important. 

This lawsuit reminds me of those Confucian scholar in late Q'ing complaining about how the Imperial Court was moving away from its Confucian core and adopting "Western practices".

If you look at my update I changed it to a 2.0 to 3.0.

The way you are describing is kind of like affirmative action with a catch. Accept a person that doesnt meet the basic requirements or accept a person that is not within the range of applicants. Therefore not considering the valedictorian of the school or student body president with great SAT scores.

Colleges want the best candidates...grads and reputation are what keeps the tuition and grant dollars rolling in.  The question is what "best candidate" means.

 

[eyephone]

Look at the end of the day. I?m looking out for the small guy.
I think students and parents should be informed. I really do.

I know college applications are pricey. Therefore, if there is a slightest chance of you not getting in. Why apply there?