Veterans Cemetery coming to Irvine

[momopi]

Maybe then momo is just pro-cemetery so he can plant a vegetable garden on PatStar's grave.  He will use the cemetery not only to farm vegetables, but also as a trap to lure unsuspecting mule deer so he can shoot and eat them.

The CA mule deer population has declined from 2 million down to 400,000 to 500,000 over the past 50 years due to a number of reasons.  Unlike rabbits they do not adopt to urbanization as well.  Given choice I think it's better not to depopulate the remaining mule deer near here and only hunt them for food in emergencies.

I think a mixed-use cemetery/conservation parkland strategy might be beneficial.  Instead of Rose Hills style cemetery, we could utilize local open space areas for "parkland buriel" by having trees & native vegetation planted on top over the graves & allowed to "return to nature" over time.  The area is then maintained using cemetery trust funds instead of public coffer, and won't be turned into suburbs.  Areas like Quail Hill and Laguna Crossing would've been perfect.  Folks can take a nice nature hike through the hills and visit their loved one's grave sites, and the local wildlife would benefit as well.  If the deer becomes overpopulated then a limited number of archery deer tags can be issued (high powered hunting rifles require at least 500-600+ yards for safe bullet drop and might not be suitable).

Local City, Regional, and State parks can all benefit from such an arrangement.  It cost a lot of money to build/maintain a park, and sale of on-site burial plots can offset the expense.  Cemetery trust funds can also contribute to the maintenance of the parkland.  However we would need better acceptance of burials without individual headstones.

Going even further, back in the 1970s-1980s many local school districts were selling land to developers to off-set their budget deficits.  How to return land to schools and prevent them from selling it off whenever they need money?  A dual use cemetery/sports area might work, where private investors purchase land next to the school and build baseball & football/soccor fields that is also used for burials, but no headstone is permitted. Maintenance of the land is paid for by cemetery trust (money from those who bought the plots) and the school is given permission to use it for sports.  New laws will need to be passed to protect the cemetery trust from lawsuits, and the school will not be in any position to sell off the land for money.  If you loved football, what better way to celebrite your love for sports by being buried under a football field?

 

[yaliu07]

...and wouldn't you rather be buried in an auspicious, positive location?

define POSITIVE location. 

BTW, did you know that many city/regional parks around here allowed tree burials at one time or another, where you could pay to have your ashes buried under a new tree planting?  No grave markers allowed, but you could pay to have a park bench placed with your name on it.  My favorite HS teacher is buried under a tree at El Dorado Park in Long Beach.  Something to keep in mind next time when you visit the local parks! 

where?  find me a park in Southern CA that allow this.  I google El Dorado Park and there is no information on tree burial. 

 

[The Motor Court Company]

easy there. I am just joking and don't even own a dog. this shows how yaliu feels being "violated" by having a cemetery that is close to his neighborhood. every day he drives by, he must feel like getting pooped on.

If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

#troll

 

[momopi]

If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

Many ciites require dog owners to keep their dogs on a leash in the park, and the dogs can't run and stay healthy.  Dog parks are few and far between.  But this presents an opportunity.  What if dog lovers are willing to be buried in a "cemetery dog park" where dog owners can let their dogs run?  Many dog parks are really small and crowded, but if enough dog lovers are willing, the cemetery dog park can be built to much larger scale.

 

[momopi]

If you have to feed the Koi fish @ Rose Hills when no ones looking, probably means you shouldn't be feeding the fish.

I fed them because they always looked hungry, and I might need them as emergecy food later.  But it's easier to stock MRE's and freeze-dried food at home.

What I thought reading momo's original post:  Momo made friends with a koi he regularly fed and talked to at Puente Hills Mall.  Momo goes to the mall one day and the pond and koi are gone!  He searches tirelessly for years until one day, he is visiting a grave at Rose Hills and he is reunited with his old friend.  The koi sees momo and jumps into his arms with joy.

Reality:  Momo was just fattening him up to eat him.

There are many other places with koi to visit, such as Embassy Suites in Brea, Cerritos Public Library (by City Hall), etc.  Due to the chemicals used in the water, I don't recommend eating the koi for regular consumption (not to mention legal complications).  Only for dire emergencies.  I'd also suggest trimming the back, side, & belly fat and remove the skin.  Cook on grill and allow fish oil to drip away.  Avoid the koi at the Mission in SJC, they look ill.  Other sources include grass carp found at local Golf Course ponds.

But, as I mentioned earlier, it's easier/cheaper to just spend $100 on a case of MRE's.  I spend the $$ on gas to visit koi to reduce my blood pressure.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Don't they have koi at Fashion Island?

 

[eyephone]

Maybe then momo is just pro-cemetery so he can plant a vegetable garden on PatStar's grave.  He will use the cemetery not only to farm vegetables, but also as a trap to lure unsuspecting mule deer so he can shoot and eat them.

The CA mule deer population has declined from 2 million down to 400,000 to 500,000 over the past 50 years due to a number of reasons.  Unlike rabbits they do not adopt to urbanization as well.  Given choice I think it's better not to depopulate the remaining mule deer near here and only hunt them for food in emergencies.

I think a mixed-use cemetery/conservation parkland strategy might be beneficial.  Instead of Rose Hills style cemetery, we could utilize local open space areas for "parkland buriel" by having trees & native vegetation planted on top over the graves & allowed to "return to nature" over time.  The area is then maintained using cemetery trust funds instead of public coffer, and won't be turned into suburbs.  Areas like Quail Hill and Laguna Crossing would've been perfect.  Folks can take a nice nature hike through the hills and visit their loved one's grave sites, and the local wildlife would benefit as well.  If the deer becomes overpopulated then a limited number of archery deer tags can be issued (high powered hunting rifles require at least 500-600+ yards for safe bullet drop and might not be suitable).

Local City, Regional, and State parks can all benefit from such an arrangement.  It cost a lot of money to build/maintain a park, and sale of on-site burial plots can offset the expense.  Cemetery trust funds can also contribute to the maintenance of the parkland.  However we would need better acceptance of burials without individual headstones.

Going even further, back in the 1970s-1980s many local school districts were selling land to developers to off-set their budget deficits.  How to return land to schools and prevent them from selling it off whenever they need money?  A dual use cemetery/sports area might work, where private investors purchase land next to the school and build baseball & football/soccor fields that is also used for burials, but no headstone is permitted. Maintenance of the land is paid for by cemetery trust (money from those who bought the plots) and the school is given permission to use it for sports.  New laws will need to be passed to protect the cemetery trust from lawsuits, and the school will not be in any position to sell off the land for money.  If you loved football, what better way to celebrite your love for sports by being buried under a football field?

I think you want a forest at Great Park with fish and animals.

#HungerGames

 

[PatrickStar]

If the cemetery does get built, and PatStar is buried there, I will make sure my dog does her business on his grave every morning.

#troll

Can't I rest in peace in the cemetery without my name coming up?  And yes, SoCal --- I do agree that Cal Court is trolling this thread, but I actually believe he is trolling yaliu. If you refer back to one of Cal Courts earliest posts here, he clearly states he is for the cemetery:

personally i like cemeteries. it adds a unique feel to the area. I think there is no better use of toxic land.

Given that, it is completely reasonable to deduct that Cal Court knows that posting vicious anti-Veteran language in a thread started and presided over by yaliu -- a leader (the leader?) of the anti-Veteran Cemetery petition drive can only serve to undermine that effort and make a mockery of those associated with it.  Perhaps the reason the city council rolled their eyes when presented with the petition is they were aware of the language being used online around this effort --- and I know for certain they are aware, I made sure of that.  Cal Court is certainly aware that personal attacks on a Veteran does nothing to help the petition effort, and everything to hurt it.

I actually feel bad for yaliu.  I do respect his efforts, even if I don't agree.  But it is clear he is not sophisticated enough to understand that anti-Veteran discussion is a political landmine in the US. If he did, he surely would have repudiated Cal Courts trolling of his petition efforts long ago.  I would venture Cal Courts trolling of this thread has done far more damage to those presiding over the petition than anything I or others could say.  And yaliu does not even realize it.  If I was one of the other 428 people who signed his petition, I'd want to talk with yaliu about just what he thought he was accomplishing with this train wreck of a discussion thread.

 

[WTTCHMN]

Yes, TI is like a train wreck.  PatStar says he'll walk away but can't help himself and comes back to look anyway.

#wishIwasinIrvine

 

[eyephone]

@Patrick - Again, Yalui has the constitutional right to ask why. This is America, where we can question without fear of prosecution. That is why the founding fathers created the constitution fear of government becoming too powerful.

Yalui is expressing his opinion which is not illegal. So what do you want the City Council to order the Irvine police to arrest Yalui? Would that make you happy? I can tell you that will never happen!!

 

[PatrickStar]

@Patrick - Again, Yalui has the constitutional right to ask why. This is America, where we can question without fear of prosecution. That is why the founding fathers created the constitution fear of government becoming too powerful.

Yalui is expressing his opinion which is not illegal. So what do you want the City Council to order the Irvine police to arrest Yalui? Would that make you happy? I can tell you that will never happen!!

eyephone, I will have to join IHO and say I don't think you get it.  Nobody is arguing yaliu or anyone else's rights to petition or protest.  I am well versed in those rights; remember I was one of those charged with upholding it. Nobody is suggesting yaliu go to jail. If you guys really wanted, you could even go picket outside actual funerals with signs that say "get out of Irvine Veterans". You would never be arrested --- that's your right.  But what IHO was telling you earlier is just because you have freedom of speech does not mean you have freedom from consequences.  Go walk into your bosses office right now and say "You are the dumbest and ugliest muthaf**ker I have ever met".  You will NOT be arrested. But you will probably be fired.  The Constitution protects your speech, but not its consequences.

Same thing here.  You can say anything you want, you won't be arrested. But in a country that is pro-Veteran (and it is), disparaging Veterans is probably not the best approach to get to your end goal. That's why the ugly language on this thread actually supports MY goal to get the Cemetery built. Cal Court can call me any name he wants, he won't be arrested.  But that does not mean his words will not damage him if they were attributed directly to him. I guarantee Cal Court would not go on record at Irvine City Hall and say that.  Or on camera on the TV news and say that. Why?  Not because he would be arrested, but because he would probably suffer personal backlash.

Google "freedom of speech but not from consequences" for other examples if you don't believe me.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

I think PatStar is trolling. He does not even live in Irvine and the cemetery may not be for him when he passes away. Yaliu is opposing the cemetery which I am neutral (I have reasons both for and against it); PatStar is turning this into an anti Veteran thread, which it is absolutely not this is about. It is about the cemetery period. Being a Veterans cemetery or dog cemetery it is still a cemetery.
So I fail to see how PatStar has any interest in here other than trolling. And me against 1 single veteran Patstar is not because he is a veteran, is because he has entitlement issues and is still holding a grudge against Irvine does not mean I disrespect veterans in general.

 

[PatrickStar]

I think PatStar is trolling. He does not even live in Irvine and the cemetery may not be for him when he passes away. Yaliu is opposing the cemetery which I am neutral (I have reasons both for and against it); PatStar is turning this into an anti Veteran thread, which it is absolutely not this is about. It is about the cemetery period. Being a Veterans cemetery or dog cemetery it is still a cemetery.
So I fail to see how PatStar has any interest in here other than trolling. And me against 1 single veteran Patstar is not because he is a veteran, is because he has entitlement issues and is still holding a grudge against Irvine does not mean I disrespect veterans in general.

The irony of it all is I really don't care about Irvine, Cal Court.  I only came back to this board after three years because somebody told me I was being talked about, and I wanted to have a little fun with old friends.  As a matter of fact --- even after I saw this mess of a thread I at first just laughed at it and even trolled it a little myself with a stupid balloon pic and some kpop, in hopes of playfully killing it.  But then you and others decided to get all personal and insulting --- and then I perked up.  See, what you don't realize is we Veteran's have this code of honor with each other.  Same with cops and firefighters.  Maybe you have seen stuff about this on your TV?  Most people will never get what we went through, so we MUST support each other. So even if I never step foot in Irvine again, and even if I am buried in Rose Hills with the rest of my extended family, I will still do everything I can to support the Veteran Cemetery for my brothers who will be, up to and including ensuring your City Council is aware of language attributed to the petition effort. So your stupid comments have only served to embolden me, and those who support this cemetery that I have shared your sentiment with.

So keep talking. You know what you are doing --- you are no dummy. You are the #1 troll on this board. I should actually be thanking you for all the material to fire up the pro-cemetery troops. After all, with the pro-Veteran sentiment in the US (and particularly in Orange County) the only real risk to losing the fight for the cemetery was apathy by its proponents. And you are doing your best to fire Veterans up and ensure we stand together in support of it.  Congratulations. 

 

[WTTCHMN]

I think you overestimate the pro-veteran sentiment in the US.  If this country really cared, we wouldn't be letting our veterans rot in the VA health care system.  If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

#trainwreck #don'tcareaboutIrvinebutcan'tstopfromlooking

 

[PatrickStar]

If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

What makes you think I don't, bones? Is there something I said to indicate I don't volunteer for or contribute to VA organizations? I thought this thread was about the cemetery?  If you have a thread on TI about VA health care I would be glad to participate if you would point me to it.

 

[bones]

If you really want to make a difference, you should be fighting for veterans rights while they are still alive... more so than a place for when they die.

What makes you think I don't, bones? Is there something I said to indicate I don't volunteer for or contribute to VA organizations? I thought this thread was about the cemetery?  If you have a thread on TI about VA health care I would be glad to participate if you would point me to it.

Bones here. I don't think I directed anything towards you. Please don't get me and whoever you are talking to confused. Anyone can create a username to mimic another member. Case in point so-cal and socal.  I don't give two shits about this train wreck veterans cemetary thread bc I hold firm in my belief that it won't get built bc of various hurdles.

 

[Happiness]

Whether the veterans cemetery gets built or not will depend on a lot of important things happening that are uncertain at this time.  However, I'm pretty sure a few superstitious residents or this silly thread will not weigh heavily in the process.  So why all this vitriol that in the end probably make no difference?  We're all going to live here for a long time whether the cemetery is built or not and we need to learn to be respectful of each other.  Patstar may not be very diplomatic, but his heart is in the right place; he is trying to save some people he believes to be underinformed from doing something self destructive.  Assuming what Patstar has posted about himself over the years is true, he would be the last person to want to see Asians maligned in America.

 

 

[bones]

Whether the veterans cemetery gets built or not will depend on a lot of important things happening that are uncertain at this time.  However, I'm pretty sure a few superstitious residents or this silly thread will not weigh heavily in the process.  So why all this vitriol that in the end probably make no difference?  We're all going to live here for a long time whether the cemetery is built or not and we need to learn to be respectful of each other.  Patstar may not be very diplomatic, but his heart is in the right place; he is trying to save some people he believes to be underinformed from doing something self destructive.  Assuming what Patstar has posted about himself over the years is true, he would be the last person to want to see Asians maligned in America.

 

Agree. Nothing anyone says in this thread will make a difference. I commend patstar for serving our country. But please don't drag my name on a reply to a post that I didn't make. Besides, if the whole "I only came back to this forum after 3 years Blah blah blah" is true, then how the fuck does he know I was WTTCMN last year. Something's not adding up here.

 

[jmoney74]

So Patrick Star has voted no on the cemetary..

 

[yaliu07]

AGAIN, we are just asking to relocate the cemetery.  I also respect Veteran and I mentioned that multiple times in this thread.