So who is watching the debate tonight. SB interesting

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As a society we all benefit from our citizens being educated, so we are all users of education, particularly businesses that need educated workers. I often hear childless people ranting about paying taxes for education. We don't have, nor will we have children, but we are happy to pay taxes that will provide education for everyone as we know it is in our best interest.
 
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. . . the reason why some people don't want an educated population
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1223578489][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223562463][quote author="WINEX" date=1223555286][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223515955][quote author="WINEX" date=1223459325][quote author="Trooper" date=1223458686]What's with this 3 million dollar projector McCain keeps talking about ? I mean, if it was for a planetarium so kids could learn about space during field trips....what's so bad about that?



3 Million.....seems pretty weak. Couldn't he find some pork.....say in the 300 million range to gripe about ?



So, here is McCain's kind of 3 million dollar project.....<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/08/mccain-bear-problem.php">studying grizzly bear DNA.</a></blockquote>


Can you show me where in the Constitution it specifies that the Federal government should be involved in subsidizing planetariums?</blockquote>




Yeah! and on that note Can you show me where in the Constitution it says we should spend tax payers hard money to Fly to the Moon ie nasa.</blockquote>


You do realize that space is a defense program don't you?</blockquote>


I think your grasping. I found noting about Nasa. Anyhow I think you get the point. The govt funds lots of things and funding for education is important



I think funding for education is very important. since the feds paid for 3 years of my college tuition via pell grants.



But im sure much of what was learned about missles came from NASA



The United States Department of Defense (DOD or DoD) is the federal department charged with coordinating and supervising all agencies and functions of the government relating directly to national security and the military. The organization and functions of the DOD are set forth in Title 10 of the United States Code.

The DOD is the major tenant of The Pentagon building near Washington, D.C., and has three major components ? the Department of the Army, the Department of the Navy, and the Department of the Air Force. Among the many DOD agencies are the Missile Defense Agency, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the Pentagon Force Protection Agency (PFPA), the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA), and the National Security Agency (NSA). The department also operates several joint service schools, including the National War College.</blockquote>


Can you point to the part of the Constitution that says that the Federal government should fund education? I don't seem to have that part in my copy of the Constitution.</blockquote>




If your upset with the abuses of the constitution. I think you should vote for the candidate who Was a professer of consitutional Law at the University of Chicgao for 6 years.



I think there are a lot of things not in the consitution, it is over 200 years old after all, the world has changed a lot. thats why they right amendments I guess.



we could go on like this all day I am not even close to a law or politics expert. I studyed exercise psysiology and chemistry in College.





P.S. : before i go looking for the education part in the consitution can you show me the Data that says NASA is a Part of the DEPT of Defence. I could not find that?



-Not on wikipedia, and not on the dept of defence web page.



it certainly is gray?
 
[quote author="stepping_up" date=1223590510]As a society we all benefit from our citizens being educated, so we are all users of education, particularly businesses that need educated workers. I often hear childless people ranting about paying taxes for education. We don't have, nor will we have children, but we are happy to pay taxes that will provide education for everyone as we know it is in our best interest.</blockquote>


- the kids that get educated hopefully earn more attract jobs then they pay Taxes too. Like

-social security

-medicare, medicade.



You see the older folks pay to educate the youngfolks.

then when the old folks age the youngfolks help fund them in their retirement. or they help pay down the 10 trillion in dept the older folks (read Boomers) created.



or the young folks can help pay the 50 til for SS for the boomers.
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1223589636][quote author="stepping_up" date=1223589062]Education is an investment.... an educated society is more productive, earns more and commits fewer crimes. I don't mind paying taxes for an investment like that.</blockquote>


I agree that education is essential. But that doesn't explain why the Feds should be subsidizing something they aren't authorized to engage in. There are state and municipal bodies that can handle these needs more effectively than the Feds. And here's another shocking idea, why not tax the users of education instead of everyone?</blockquote>


With all the Federal intervention in the financial markets and various bailouts leading us into either socialism or communism, I can't get too worked up over whether or not they spend money on something that probably gives a return on investment like education.
 
[quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223597700][quote author="WINEX" date=1223578489][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223562463][quote author="WINEX" date=1223555286][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223515955][quote author="WINEX" date=1223459325][quote author="Trooper" date=1223458686]What's with this 3 million dollar projector McCain keeps talking about ? I mean, if it was for a planetarium so kids could learn about space during field trips....what's so bad about that?



3 Million.....seems pretty weak. Couldn't he find some pork.....say in the 300 million range to gripe about ?



So, here is McCain's kind of 3 million dollar project.....<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/08/mccain-bear-problem.php">studying grizzly bear DNA.</a></blockquote>


Can you show me where in the Constitution it specifies that the Federal government should be involved in subsidizing planetariums?</blockquote>




Yeah! and on that note Can you show me where in the Constitution it says we should spend tax payers hard money to Fly to the Moon ie nasa.</blockquote>


You do realize that space is a defense program don't you?</blockquote>


I think your grasping. I found noting about Nasa. Anyhow I think you get the point. The govt funds lots of things and funding for education is important



I think funding for education is very important. since the feds paid for 3 years of my college tuition via pell grants.



But im sure much of what was learned about missles came from NASA



The United States Department of Defense (DOD or DoD) is the federal department charged with coordinating and supervising all agencies and functions of the government relating directly to national security and the military. The organization and functions of the DOD are set forth in Title 10 of the United States Code.

The DOD is the major tenant of The Pentagon building near Washington, D.C., and has three major components ? the Department of the Army, the Department of the Navy, and the Department of the Air Force. Among the many DOD agencies are the Missile Defense Agency, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the Pentagon Force Protection Agency (PFPA), the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA), and the National Security Agency (NSA). The department also operates several joint service schools, including the National War College.</blockquote>


Can you point to the part of the Constitution that says that the Federal government should fund education? I don't seem to have that part in my copy of the Constitution.</blockquote>




If your upset with the abuses of the constitution. I think you should vote for the candidate who Was a professer of consitutional Law at the University of Chicgao for 6 years.



I think there are a lot of things not in the consitution, it is over 200 years old after all, the world has changed a lot. thats why they right amendments I guess.



we could go on like this all day I am not even close to a law or politics expert. I studyed exercise psysiology and chemistry in College.





P.S. : before i go looking for the education part in the consitution can you show me the Data that says NASA is a Part of the DEPT of Defence. I could not find that?



-Not on wikipedia, and not on the dept of defence web page.



it certainly is gray?</blockquote>


It looks like you need to educate yourself on more things than I was aware of.



The Constitution doesn't say anything about the "Department of Defense". It DOES vest the power to provide for a common defense on the Federal government.



Now, how about showing me the part of the Constitution that gives the Federal government the power to be involved in education....
 
[quote author="IrvineRenter" date=1223615525][quote author="WINEX" date=1223589636][quote author="stepping_up" date=1223589062]Education is an investment.... an educated society is more productive, earns more and commits fewer crimes. I don't mind paying taxes for an investment like that.</blockquote>


I agree that education is essential. But that doesn't explain why the Feds should be subsidizing something they aren't authorized to engage in. There are state and municipal bodies that can handle these needs more effectively than the Feds. And here's another shocking idea, why not tax the users of education instead of everyone?</blockquote>


With all the Federal intervention in the financial markets and various bailouts leading us into either socialism or communism, I can't get too worked up over whether or not they spend money on something that probably gives a return on investment like education.</blockquote>


So am I correct in assuming that you were against the Feds being involved in education (and other activities that they aren't authorized to engage in) up until last Friday? If that isn't the case, aren't you just rationalizing poor judgment?
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1223618675][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223597700][quote author="WINEX" date=1223578489][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223562463][quote author="WINEX" date=1223555286][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223515955][quote author="WINEX" date=1223459325][quote author="Trooper" date=1223458686]What's with this 3 million dollar projector McCain keeps talking about ? I mean, if it was for a planetarium so kids could learn about space during field trips....what's so bad about that?



3 Million.....seems pretty weak. Couldn't he find some pork.....say in the 300 million range to gripe about ?



So, here is McCain's kind of 3 million dollar project.....<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/08/mccain-bear-problem.php">studying grizzly bear DNA.</a></blockquote>


Can you show me where in the Constitution it specifies that the Federal government should be involved in subsidizing planetariums?</blockquote>




Yeah! and on that note Can you show me where in the Constitution it says we should spend tax payers hard money to Fly to the Moon ie nasa.</blockquote>


You do realize that space is a defense program don't you?</blockquote>


I think your grasping. I found noting about Nasa. Anyhow I think you get the point. The govt funds lots of things and funding for education is important



I think funding for education is very important. since the feds paid for 3 years of my college tuition via pell grants.



But im sure much of what was learned about missles came from NASA



The United States Department of Defense (DOD or DoD) is the federal department charged with coordinating and supervising all agencies and functions of the government relating directly to national security and the military. The organization and functions of the DOD are set forth in Title 10 of the United States Code.

The DOD is the major tenant of The Pentagon building near Washington, D.C., and has three major components ? the Department of the Army, the Department of the Navy, and the Department of the Air Force. Among the many DOD agencies are the Missile Defense Agency, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the Pentagon Force Protection Agency (PFPA), the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA), and the National Security Agency (NSA). The department also operates several joint service schools, including the National War College.</blockquote>


Can you point to the part of the Constitution that says that the Federal government should fund education? I don't seem to have that part in my copy of the Constitution.</blockquote>




If your upset with the abuses of the constitution. I think you should vote for the candidate who Was a professer of consitutional Law at the University of Chicgao for 6 years.



I think there are a lot of things not in the consitution, it is over 200 years old after all, the world has changed a lot. thats why they right amendments I guess.



we could go on like this all day I am not even close to a law or politics expert. I studyed exercise psysiology and chemistry in College.





P.S. : before i go looking for the education part in the consitution can you show me the Data that says NASA is a Part of the DEPT of Defence. I could not find that?



-Not on wikipedia, and not on the dept of defence web page.



it certainly is gray?</blockquote>


It looks like you need to educate yourself on more things than I was aware of.



The Constitution doesn't say anything about the "Department of Defense". It DOES vest the power to provide for a common defense on the Federal government.



Now, how about showing me the part of the Constitution that gives the Federal government the power to be involved in education....</blockquote>




Where did you find out that NASA is Part of the dept of defense? you said Nasa is part of dept of defense. prove it.



Your really fun to debate with.



my whole point about the Moon was we did it to learn, or cause it was there, or just to fuck with the russians or all of the above. yes the feds paid for it so what.



It seems to me that the feds have invested unconstitutional or not in a great many things that have benifited the counry and mankind in general



-where does it say we should have a Center for disease control?

-where does it say we should have an FDA?

-where does it say we should have a NIH.



some of these things I think are good.



As for feds and education im with you a bit on this. i think local may be better. as far as getting money from the fed for college well I am gratfull that I did.



Affordability is a big issue regarding college.



India invested HUGE in its education system. well look where all the engineers, Doctors and computer guys are coming from latley.
 
My husband always says, "Honey, don't wrestle with a pig. You both get muddy and the pig enjoys it." Not sure if it's still true if there is lipstick involved :)
 
[quote author="stepping_up" date=1223623589]My husband always says, "Honey, don't wrestle with a pig. You both get muddy and the pig enjoys it." Not sure if it's still true if there is lipstick involved :)</blockquote>


-ok thats true but who are you saying is a pig. Moi?



-or the dude with a copy of the us constitution on his fridge.



Any how how do you people like my new avitar?? i just did that last night.
 
hate your avatar.... I'm not calling anyone a pig, but there are times that the metaphor is apropos. I have seen on this board time and time again that it pointless to have any sort of intelligent discussion with Winex. He is absolutely right about everything and anyone who does not see the world through his bizarre glasses is an evil liberal who wants to raise his taxes. And don't let me forget stupid. I'm really sick him of calling people stupid.
 
[quote author="stepping_up" date=1223624800]hate your avatar.... I'm not calling anyone a pig, but there are times that the metaphor is apropos. I have seen on this board time and time again that it pointless to have any sort of intelligent discussion with Winex. He is absolutely right about everything and anyone who does not see the world through his bizarre glasses is an evil liberal who wants to raise his taxes. And don't let me forget stupid. I'm really sick him of calling people stupid.</blockquote>


-ok well I will search for an avitar that is a bit less sophmoric. It was my first try and the only thing i had under 50MB.



well I remmeber from eng 101 back at Harper college



your not supposed to argue facts or preferences.



a lot of people like to argue facts.
 
[quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223624397][quote author="stepping_up" date=1223623589]My husband always says, "Honey, don't wrestle with a pig. You both get muddy and the pig enjoys it." Not sure if it's still true if there is lipstick involved :)</blockquote>


-ok thats true but who are you saying is a pig. Moi?



-or the dude with a copy of the us constitution on his fridge.



<span style="color: red;">Any how how do you people like my new avitar??</span> i just did that last night.</blockquote>
Hey, how did you get my picture for your avitar?

I never did like that bathing suit.

It's a bit too big on me. :coolsmirk:
 
[quote author="CalGal" date=1223629092]

I never did like that bathing suit.

It's a bit too big on me. :coolsmirk:</blockquote>


pwns.
 
[quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223623176][quote author="WINEX" date=1223618675][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223597700][quote author="WINEX" date=1223578489][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223562463][quote author="WINEX" date=1223555286][quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223515955][quote author="WINEX" date=1223459325][quote author="Trooper" date=1223458686]What's with this 3 million dollar projector McCain keeps talking about ? I mean, if it was for a planetarium so kids could learn about space during field trips....what's so bad about that?



3 Million.....seems pretty weak. Couldn't he find some pork.....say in the 300 million range to gripe about ?



So, here is McCain's kind of 3 million dollar project.....<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/08/mccain-bear-problem.php">studying grizzly bear DNA.</a></blockquote>


Can you show me where in the Constitution it specifies that the Federal government should be involved in subsidizing planetariums?</blockquote>




Yeah! and on that note Can you show me where in the Constitution it says we should spend tax payers hard money to Fly to the Moon ie nasa.</blockquote>


You do realize that space is a defense program don't you?</blockquote>


I think your grasping. I found noting about Nasa. Anyhow I think you get the point. The govt funds lots of things and funding for education is important



I think funding for education is very important. since the feds paid for 3 years of my college tuition via pell grants.



But im sure much of what was learned about missles came from NASA



The United States Department of Defense (DOD or DoD) is the federal department charged with coordinating and supervising all agencies and functions of the government relating directly to national security and the military. The organization and functions of the DOD are set forth in Title 10 of the United States Code.

The DOD is the major tenant of The Pentagon building near Washington, D.C., and has three major components ? the Department of the Army, the Department of the Navy, and the Department of the Air Force. Among the many DOD agencies are the Missile Defense Agency, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the Pentagon Force Protection Agency (PFPA), the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA), and the National Security Agency (NSA). The department also operates several joint service schools, including the National War College.</blockquote>


Can you point to the part of the Constitution that says that the Federal government should fund education? I don't seem to have that part in my copy of the Constitution.</blockquote>




If your upset with the abuses of the constitution. I think you should vote for the candidate who Was a professer of consitutional Law at the University of Chicgao for 6 years.



I think there are a lot of things not in the consitution, it is over 200 years old after all, the world has changed a lot. thats why they right amendments I guess.



we could go on like this all day I am not even close to a law or politics expert. I studyed exercise psysiology and chemistry in College.





P.S. : before i go looking for the education part in the consitution can you show me the Data that says NASA is a Part of the DEPT of Defence. I could not find that?



-Not on wikipedia, and not on the dept of defence web page.



it certainly is gray?</blockquote>


It looks like you need to educate yourself on more things than I was aware of.



The Constitution doesn't say anything about the "Department of Defense". It DOES vest the power to provide for a common defense on the Federal government.



Now, how about showing me the part of the Constitution that gives the Federal government the power to be involved in education....</blockquote>




Where did you find out that NASA is Part of the dept of defense? you said Nasa is part of dept of defense. prove it.



Your really fun to debate with.



my whole point about the Moon was we did it to learn, or cause it was there, or just to fuck with the russians or all of the above. yes the feds paid for it so what.



It seems to me that the feds have invested unconstitutional or not in a great many things that have benifited the counry and mankind in general



-where does it say we should have a Center for disease control?

-where does it say we should have an FDA?

-where does it say we should have a NIH.



some of these things I think are good.



As for feds and education im with you a bit on this. i think local may be better. as far as getting money from the fed for college well I am gratfull that I did.



Affordability is a big issue regarding college.



India invested HUGE in its education system. well look where all the engineers, Doctors and computer guys are coming from latley.</blockquote>


Would you care to show me where I said that NASA was part of the Department of Defense? You can do that right after you show me where the Constitution says that the Feds should subsidize education.
 
- Winex your a member of the 86 club now.





"You do realize that space is a defense program don?t you?"

-Winex.



actually space is the final frontier. at least thats what they said on star trek.



I'm beginning to think that space is what you have between your Ears Winex LOL.



Isnt space a vaccum that sucks!!
 
[quote author="ventouxbob" date=1223635927]- Winex your a member of the 86 club now.





"You do realize that space is a defense program don?t you?"

-Winex.



actually space is the final frontier. at least thats what they said on star trek.



I'm beginning to think that space is what you have between your Ears Winex LOL.



Isnt space a vaccum that sucks!!</blockquote>




Yes, space is a defense program. But where did I say that NASA was part of the Department of Defense?



You mentioned earlier that Federal tax dollars helped you get your education. As a tax payer, I feel ripped off and would like a refund.
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1223618760][quote author="IrvineRenter" date=1223615525][quote author="WINEX" date=1223589636][quote author="stepping_up" date=1223589062]Education is an investment.... an educated society is more productive, earns more and commits fewer crimes. I don't mind paying taxes for an investment like that.</blockquote>


I agree that education is essential. But that doesn't explain why the Feds should be subsidizing something they aren't authorized to engage in. There are state and municipal bodies that can handle these needs more effectively than the Feds. And here's another shocking idea, why not tax the users of education instead of everyone?</blockquote>


With all the Federal intervention in the financial markets and various bailouts leading us into either socialism or communism, I can't get too worked up over whether or not they spend money on something that probably gives a return on investment like education.</blockquote>


So am I correct in assuming that you were against the Feds being involved in education (and other activities that they aren't authorized to engage in) up until last Friday? If that isn't the case, aren't you just rationalizing poor judgment?</blockquote>


No, I am in favor of the Federal government spending/investing in education. I am not a strict constructionist with regards to the constitution. I was just pointing out that you are worrying about window treatments while the foundation is crumbling.
 
Would you care to show me where I said that NASA was part of the Department of Defense? You can do that right after you show me where the Constitution says that the Feds should subsidize education.</blockquote>




I don't think the Feds should subsidize education, nor do I think the Feds should mandate ridiculous things such as No Child Left Behind, or even things that aren't ridiculous like IDEA without funding them. Thanks to GW for that one. Republicans have done a fantastic job of making government bigger.
 
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