Resale homes vs new construction

NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
ucla bruin said:
For a new home, is the backyard untouched (dirt?) until you landscape it?
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Yes.

For Resale, - Mello-roos is low but exists and its been paid since it was built - so you have to live with it for another few years (depending on bonds expiry date).
For New homes - Mello-roos is high and it is for min of 30 years (thats when bonds are typically set to expire).

For us - SFR home with traditional driveway and curb is preferred than "Stucco boxes" (courtesy indiedev) condos with no driveway and motorcourts - especially when price point is same.
 
I haven't been looking in the Irvine's home market values since recently.  Do the prices of homes in Irvine normally increase during the summer time or is there no correlation between the two?  I would think that more buyers are out hunting during summer time driving the prices up with the low resale inventory. 

If so, would this cause the new home's prices to rise as well?  ???
 
homer_simpson said:
Do the prices of homes in Irvine normally increase during the summer time or is there no correlation between the two? 

If so, would this cause the new home's prices to rise as well?  ???
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Not just in Irvine, in general summer months have highest avg listed price compared to winter months (3-5% more), simply because with holidays out of the way people get out of their current homes in search of their next home. There is obvious reason of school year, where parents can not afford to move in the middle of school year there by jeopardizing their kids' education.

Not sure, if this applies for new homes though. Builder may decide to increase or decrease prices based on inventory, upcoming phases' release schedule and demand - irrespective of summer or winter!

 
As I remember, Northwood II had maybe about 10 homes available for sale roughly in the middle of 2010, now there is only only 1 SFR available.  Have other neighborhoods in Irvine had a similar reduction in inventory like this or is this unique to Northwood II and any particular reason why? 

USCTrojanCPA said:
ucla bruin said:
Woo, 8 clap!

@USCTrojanCPA, yes sir 25 Torrey Pine was the one. I didn't particularly like the seller's aggressive style. The first counter came back and she asked for me to make a decision the same day before 7pm. I opted not to and spoke to her on the phone that night, then she sent the final counter. The property was very nice but unfortunately was not worth 870k to me. I would've been fine with 840-850 too. The tough part is that now I will be competing against the 11 (possibly your client as well?) + whoever else for similar properties :/

@woodburyowner, the Thursday night open house was pretty laid back, nice event. How do you like Woodbury neighborhood? I'm looking for something soon and is still considering WB, possibly Stonegate if I can wait.
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My guess is that the "winner" probably offered to pay somewhere between $870k to $875k.  I'm guessing that the 2nd seller counter offer was sent out because a few buyers were probably around $860k so the sellers wanted to see how much more blood they could squeeze out of the buyers by playing on their emotions.  My buyers almost didn't want to respond to the 2nd counter as it really pissed them off initially but they did like the home enough to put in their best shot.  I wonder how many of the other buyers that 2nd seller counter really turned off because it really threw my buyers and I for a little bit of a loop.  One of the reasons why my buyers bid as much as they was partially due to my expected commission rebate.
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Nope... despite what the IHB says... the "good" inventory in many parts of Irvine is few and far between.

You can't even find many Portisol models for sale in Woodbury now.

As for the reasons (just theories):

1. Lower rates is probably helping people keep their home
2. Some sellers are holding because they think prices will bounce back
3. Banks are still moving slow on distressed inventory
4. People are waiting to see what's in the new 'hoods before they move up,

I dunno... but it's keeping prices from falling as fast as they should... which can be good or bad depending on what side you are on.
 
I wanted to buy resale (2000 or newer), but ended up buying new last year.
The resales were WAY over priced when it was nicely upgraded or needed bathroom renovations at minimum.

I got sick of being outbid and ended up buying new for less than resale.  After all the upgrades that I wanted to put in, window coverings, and landscaping, the price came out to be about same as resale.  Of course, it is a lot of work to select upgrades, put in window coverings and landscaping.  But, I do get to pick exactly what I want (within budget).

 
fumbling said:
As I remember, Northwood II had maybe about 10 homes available for sale roughly in the middle of 2010, now there is only only 1 SFR available.  Have other neighborhoods in Irvine had a similar reduction in inventory like this or is this unique to Northwood II and any particular reason why? 

USCTrojanCPA said:
ucla bruin said:
Woo, 8 clap!

@USCTrojanCPA, yes sir 25 Torrey Pine was the one. I didn't particularly like the seller's aggressive style. The first counter came back and she asked for me to make a decision the same day before 7pm. I opted not to and spoke to her on the phone that night, then she sent the final counter. The property was very nice but unfortunately was not worth 870k to me. I would've been fine with 840-850 too. The tough part is that now I will be competing against the 11 (possibly your client as well?) + whoever else for similar properties :/

@woodburyowner, the Thursday night open house was pretty laid back, nice event. How do you like Woodbury neighborhood? I'm looking for something soon and is still considering WB, possibly Stonegate if I can wait.
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My guess is that the "winner" probably offered to pay somewhere between $870k to $875k.  I'm guessing that the 2nd seller counter offer was sent out because a few buyers were probably around $860k so the sellers wanted to see how much more blood they could squeeze out of the buyers by playing on their emotions.  My buyers almost didn't want to respond to the 2nd counter as it really pissed them off initially but they did like the home enough to put in their best shot.  I wonder how many of the other buyers that 2nd seller counter really turned off because it really threw my buyers and I for a little bit of a loop.  One of the reasons why my buyers bid as much as they was partially due to my expected commission rebate.
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I don't remember Northwood II having 10 homes for sale in the middle of 2010.  All I know is that there is a lack of good SFR inventory out there.
 
bones said:
think about it this way:  no driveway = one less area to landscape!
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You are kidding, right?  What do you have to landscape with a full driveway (that's something the builder includes)?  FULL DRIVEWAY OR BUST!!!
 
i bid $860K on 25 Torrey Pine.  Crazy...  I didnt like the process at all.  counter counter counter.  I couldnt go higher.  I know it wont appraise for the asking price, so when they added to remove appraisal contingency, I was out. 

There were 2 ALL CASH offers as well out there.  At least that's what I was told.  Sucks, I really liked the location and the name of the street (avid golfer).   

 
Did you also look at 24 Grape Arbor listed for $879k?  It looks like a similar size home in the same neighborhood with nice interior pics, except it backs to a neighbor and not open space (and doesn't have that nice golf-related street name haha).  Just curious why this home has been sitting for 3 months while 25 Torrey Pine sold in a couple of weeks?

akim997 said:
i bid $860K on 25 Torrey Pine.  Crazy...  I didnt like the process at all.  counter counter counter.  I couldnt go higher.  I know it wont appraise for the asking price, so when they added to remove appraisal contingency, I was out. 

There were 2 ALL CASH offers as well out there.  At least that's what I was told.  Sucks, I really liked the location and the name of the street (avid golfer).   
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I didn't like the floor plan at 24 Grape Arbor. Kitchen wasn't fully upgraded, there were also some wasted space, not a fan of the spatial arrangement. I believe they converted 1 of the rooms upstairs to a open den right next to the stairs. If I remember correctly, the downstairs floor has 2 different kind of dark wood too, mismatched. Of course all these can be changed but it's just more work than I'd like to do. Gonna go check out another place at lunch time. If this doesn't pan out, I might look into Stonegate.
 
Those Campanile homes seem overpriced to me at $800k+.

But then again, in Quail Hill as Olivos, they are even more overpriced.
 
24 Grape Arbor is what i refer to as Campanile plan 4 (its used here in NWII and in QH).  2460 sq ft.  Standard arrangements were typically 3 bedrooms + loft (optional BR4) + small niche area.  This small niche area is where you will typically see the plan with a U-shaped, 2 station work area.  Directly across the hallway is the BR4, but Grape Arbor has the loft option (no door, no closet).    I've seen many install a built in the area where the closet would go for a tv or something like that.  The bad thing about the plan is the great room - diagonal fire place and no real place to put a television (thought about drop down white screen with projector).  There is room in another corner where people will put built ins, but it just doesn't look right.  The 2460 sq ft plan IS a bit nicer in that you get extra storage via the butler pantry.  u get a sink in the laundry room, but the laundry room is now downstairs, off of the butler pantry.  there is also a nice storage closet there.  Lastly, my wife loves it for the his/hers walk in closets in the master, and the vanity desk in the master bath.  The 2315 sq ft has the downstairs BR4, and a nice media niche where the black built in was on 25 torrey pine.  less everywhere else.  smaller walkin closet and no vanity.  people have their preferences.  my wife likes the 2460 sq model and i like the 2315.  generally, NWII is more desirable than Camanile.  better neighboorhood, gated community, and IUSD.  Northpark sq is TUSD, and although hicks canyon and orchard hills are great, parents absolutely prefer NW high vs. Beckman.  $142Hoa in NWII vs $74 in NP Sq.  Mello is about $3100 in NWII and $2100 in NP Sq.  All in all, I'd take NWII any day of the week.  Campanile's location isnt that great, and next to the large set of townhomes... just doesnt feel as homey.  Both Northpark and Northpark sq, in my opionion are much less desireable to NWII and Northwood Pointe.  NW Pointe being the most desireable (South of meadowood).  I'd love to send our children to CanyonView over there. 
 
Forgot to talk about grape arbor.  Seller owes only $528K but is seemingly unwilling to budge on price.  Hate the back yard, vegitation in the front yard, and the nasty brown concrete he has.  Would have preferred standard.  Cost to change???.    I didnt ask, but I dont know if the wood flooring is glue down or floating.  If glue down, it might be expensive to demo.  Why demo?  Because the idiot has 2 types of hardwood downstairs that don't match.  The weird arrangement in Camelia for this plan was that a lot of people chose not to upgrade and ended up with a wood (or other upgraded flooring) in the entry way and in the kitchen, while the great room was carpeted.  I really hate this layout.  Further, for some who did this, they did not install the wood flooring in a continuous manner (i.e. plank direction from front to back).  Rather, some people have it front to back in the entry and side to side in the kitchen.  hate that.  look at 25 torrey pine.  All front to back throughout downstairs.  24 grape arbor has the less desireable hardwood actually continue up the stairs to the lofts.  just didnt like it.  also, thinking of potential accidents of kids slipping on stairs - i just prefer carpet from the stairs up.  Kitchen in grape arbor isn't a big deal.  standard coutnertops, but decided to upgrade the island only (wtf?).  that can be changed...  other than that, its a fairly standard model.  $879K is ridiculous.  I almost had 59 Bamboo for $786,000 as an approved short sale earlier this month.  Didnt get it because they needed an extra $20K of cash at close to cover back taxes and bank charges.  There is a new lucky owner out there!!!. 

Realtor of 25 Torrey Pine says they are prepping the same floor plan for sale in a month.  That being said, they will try to leverage on 25 torrey pine as a comp, so expect to pay in the $870K range for this next one.  They kept on using Campanile Longvale sale as a comp.  Longvale was really nice.  French doors of the master balcony, french doors  downstairs and a very nice back yard.  Very clean.  14 Spyrock is out there, but you have another VERY stubborn seller.  Not as nice as Longvale or Torrey Pine, but is looking to get $860 MINIMUM.  That's why the house has been on the market for so long.  Again, NP Sq is not NWII. So be weary.   
 
Lastly, don't use 25 Torrey Pine as your comp.  We overbid because it really had everything we ever wanted and everything we would ever need.  From the color palette, to the closet organizers, to the shutters.  I totaled the total cost, and compared it to a similar sale on Bamboo from december ($793K).  With ALL the additions and upgrades and VIEW of the trail, 25 Torrey Pine was worth the extra price.  If you are a buyer, just play it smart and be patient.  Dont let realtors tell you "Irvine will never go down".  That's all I hear all the time and it REALLY annoys me because these were the same people who said that in 2004-2007.  Do we really have such short memories?  Supply and demand is a big issue.  Newer homes (95 and later) with a driveway - almost NO supply.  If you want to pay the premium, then go ahead.  We have decided not to succumb to the herd mentality (buy for its too late!!!!) and are going to take a breather for a while.  We have started looking in N. Tustin, because if you have a budget in the mid 800's, you can probably find a nice house on a .25acre lot.  If you are willing to deal with the power lines and no pocket parks, take a look.  Arroyo/Redhill, Hewes middle and foothill high is still really good!!!.  When i see houses, I talk to neighbors and people.  Everyone seems to really love the area, and they say its really nice and quite.  If you are asian and need to be around other asians, then dont look here.  If you like diversity... then check it out. 
 
Sorry, one last thing - if you like tustin ranch, 2 houses in el dorado are not selling.  Not really good floor plans (REALLY small family rooms), but El Dorado is nice.  One is on Hiskey... dont like that one since its basically attached to the front gate.
 
I'm going to give akim the "Chain Poster of the Week" award!

But those were really great posts, it shows how much people think about purchasing their homes and that it's not a simple decision. I see location, schools, floorplan, design, decor, features and tons of small things in his posts.

BTW: You forgot to tell them that those homes in El Dorado are 3CWG ones and have the izz-O formation. The one on Schooley has the floorplan I like... upstairs laundry, master retreat and bonus room. Those are much better values than Campanile ($800-$830k) but I do understand the location factor. If the one on Schooley was $750k... I might leave the Land of the iHome.
 
shhh... dont let the secret out...  yeah, i do love the 3 car garages...  i've seen Schooley, and for the right price, I'd jump on it as well, although it won't go down to $750.  i've priced it out, and believe it or not, its not THAT expensive to remodel a downstairs...  (~40-50K) but if you are buying cheap, so what?
 
akim997,

Thanks for all your insights into making an offer on a home.

I was curious though, why are you looking into Tustin Ranch and even N. Tustin when you seem to place such high value of NW High/IUSD over Beckman/TUSD. IMHO, the schools associated with NP and NP SQ are excellent by most measures.

As far as neighborhood rankings go--it is all opinion but here is my ranking:
1) Quail Hill*
2) Northwood Pointe
3) NorthPark
4) WB
5) NP Square
6) NW II
(*Of course if price were not a problem Shady would be #1)

NWII has some nice homes but my kids love the NP Sq tot lot even more  :)
 
ahhh... very good question...  for me it's all about value.    when negotiating and speaking to realtors, they keep saying "irvine irvine irvine"....  soooo... they want to charge you prices associated.  i guess they kind of have a right to, since its the same nice area and the schools are all awesome. 

the thing about n. tustin, and tustin ranch, is its a comparable bargain/ sq ft.  You also can get 3 car garages and large lots.  we actually really do like northpark, but we don't like ANY of the floorplans in our price range. 
 
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