Augusta at Columbus Square

[qwerty]

i could be wrong but home prices are take into account whether or not the area homes have MR. if you bought a home in Laguna Niguel, if there was no MR, that means that the home price was just that much higher. these things are priced at what can be financed which is the total combo of principal/interest/insurance/taxes/MR/HOA.

So when people get concerned about the MR, all that means is that the home price has to be that much lower so someone can afford it. so while i understand the visual/mental impact of paying 8K in MR its just one component of the cost.  If these augusta homes had no mello roos, they would be priced 150-200K higher. This is the same with the new homes in Stonegate, Portola Springs, Laguna altura, if there was no MR there, i can guarantee you TIC would jack up the price 100-200K more, whatever the MR converts to in terms of principal equivalent.

If you could pay up front, it wouldn't be as big of a deal.  But besides, Stonegate is $3600 per year.

that is the point im trying to make. Stonegate is $3,600 per year in MR, but if it was 8,000, the price of the home would be lower. at the end of the day you have to compare the total monthly payment to be able to compare apples to apples and then adjust for the location premium. to compare one developments MR of 8,000 with another for 6K or 3,6000 is somewhat irrelevant.

True enough, but let's not forget that you can deduct mortgage interest, but not MR (legally). 

As long as it's plain as day how much it will be and everyone knows, I guess the market will decide what the corresponding price will be.

yeah, we cant even deduct the property taxes and like you said MR is not deductible. So a place like Augusta that would be upwards of 14K in property taxes and MR is kind of hard to swallow. so for us, like you said, we would prefer the MR component of the overall price to be as small as possible

 

[shokunin]

Exactly, Mello Roos is a set dollar amount that never changes.  The percentage depends upon what the ultimate sales price is.  I'd be curious to know how long those Mello Roos bonds are at VOC....are they 20, 25, 30, or 35 years? 

When we look at Ciara at CG the MR had a stipulation of annual increases to the Mello Roos up to 2% a year based on CPI.  I asked if they were fixed and was told it would be reassessed every year based on the CPI.  Not sure if the current developments are the same, but double check the fine print on your disclosures. 

 

[shokunin]

Here's a picture of the special tax document with the 2% increase clause...

 

[davenlei]

i could be wrong but home prices are take into account whether or not the area homes have MR. if you bought a home in Laguna Niguel, if there was no MR, that means that the home price was just that much higher. these things are priced at what can be financed which is the total combo of principal/interest/insurance/taxes/MR/HOA.

So when people get concerned about the MR, all that means is that the home price has to be that much lower so someone can afford it. so while i understand the visual/mental impact of paying 8K in MR its just one component of the cost.  If these augusta homes had no mello roos, they would be priced 150-200K higher. This is the same with the new homes in Stonegate, Portola Springs, Laguna altura, if there was no MR there, i can guarantee you TIC would jack up the price 100-200K more, whatever the MR converts to in terms of principal equivalent.

If I take that "No MR Premium price" into account between the lower price of the 3000 sq. Ft home and what I paid for my home, it wold take less than 6 years of MR payments to make the price difference.  Who is pocketing the remaining 19+ years of MR payments?

 

[davenlei]

Here's a picture of the special tax document with the 2% increase clause...

Wait. Is that document saying the MR (special tax) will also increase 2% every year and not stay static like normal MR?

 

[uciguy]

Sounds like it to me.

 

[usctrojancpa]

Here's a picture of the special tax document with the 2% increase clause...

What a scam...Mello Roos is other cities like Irvine and Aliso Viejo is fixed for 20-30+ years and the property tax (based upon Prop 13) can increase up 2% or decrease, never thought that Mello Roos could.  From my understanding, Mello Roos is based upon a BOND with a FIXED interest rate so it shouldn't go up or down (unless part of the bond is paid off/down).

 

[test]

Here's a picture of the special tax document with the 2% increase clause...

What a scam...Mello Roos is other cities like Irvine and Aliso Viejo is fixed for 20-30+ years and the property tax (based upon Prop 13) can increase up 2% or decrease, never thought that Mello Roos could.  From my understanding, Mello Roos is based upon a BOND with a FIXED interest rate so it shouldn't go up or down (unless part of the bond is paid off/down).

You sure about that?  CPI is always a good excuse to raise taxes. 

 

[davenlei]

Here's a picture of the special tax document with the 2% increase clause...

What a scam...Mello Roos is other cities like Irvine and Aliso Viejo is fixed for 20-30+ years and the property tax (based upon Prop 13) can increase up 2% or decrease, never thought that Mello Roos could.  From my understanding, Mello Roos is based upon a BOND with a FIXED interest rate so it shouldn't go up or down (unless part of the bond is paid off/down).

You sure about that?  CPI is always a good excuse to raise taxes. 

2% compounding increase a year for 20-30 years is a LOT of additional money to pay off the MR than what most people think it will cost them.

 

[test]

2% compounding increase a year for 20-30 years is a LOT of additional money to pay off the MR than what most people think it will cost them.

Just another way the government rips people off.  They can thank Henry Mello and Mike Roos, both of them Democrats.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

i could be wrong but home prices are take into account whether or not the area homes have MR. if you bought a home in Laguna Niguel, if there was no MR, that means that the home price was just that much higher. these things are priced at what can be financed which is the total combo of principal/interest/insurance/taxes/MR/HOA.

So when people get concerned about the MR, all that means is that the home price has to be that much lower so someone can afford it. so while i understand the visual/mental impact of paying 8K in MR its just one component of the cost.  If these augusta homes had no mello roos, they would be priced 150-200K higher. This is the same with the new homes in Stonegate, Portola Springs, Laguna altura, if there was no MR there, i can guarantee you TIC would jack up the price 100-200K more, whatever the MR converts to in terms of principal equivalent.

Not directly.

As much as we would like it to be that way... since MRs are almost like a "hidden" cost, it does not impact the price relatively dollar for dollar. That's similar to saying that prices are proportionately lower or higher based on the interest rates.

Laguna Niguel has new homes without MRs but I don't think they are significantly more than Irvine's.

And Columbus Grove had huge MRs and were priced pretty high too.

That being said... so is test backing off on his "find a 3000sft home with lower MRs" and replacing it with "you get more infrastructure for those ridiculously high MRs"?

 

[edhne]

USC,

Interesting. how do you think this compares with las ventanas then given las ventanas is near land fill and near free way and has fire hazards. You said you were considering buying their yourself so wanted to hear your thoughts on why Las Ventanas is ok but this location is a "pass".

shadax,

Most people don't understand mello roos, and the way it's advertised doesn't help.  Mello roos is based on square footage and only square footage.  Terms like effective rate and percentage of sales price is totally meaningless and misleading.  So you need to compare apples to apples by looking at square footage vs square footage, not sales price or tax rate.

Now, CS is significantly less the CG.

I looked into the details of the actual taxes being paid and that's only one of the special assessments, they each have different ones.  CS for example pays for the new school while CG doesn't, since only CS residents get to attend.

What does it matter if I'm poisoned, drowned, or shot? I'm still dead.  And no matter how it's explained, computed, or advertised, it's still $8,000 a year in taxes ABOVE the base property tax rate.  And that's still outrageous.

The only "problem" with advertising it the way they did is that I have to compute the additional yearly taxes on my own, based on the percentage they came up with...even if that's not how the taxes are determined.  They probably advertise it that way because they don't want to stick $8,000 per year on there. 

You're still not getting it.  $8k is not outrageous for a 3k sqft home.  Show me the mello roos for another 3k sqft home.  At least you're not buying the 4k sqft Gables model.  If you want to pay less mello roos then buy a smaller home or an older home.  Homes built in the 90's have a mello roos about half that.  Like I said, you need to compare apples to apples.

Homes in the 90s have a Mello Roos that's 1/4 or 1/5 that these guys are trying to charge.  $7k-$8k in Mello Roos for the pleasure of living on some marine base with toxic soil?  No thanks...PASS!

 

[usctrojancpa]

USC,

Interesting. how do you think this compares with las ventanas then given las ventanas is near land fill and near free way and has fire hazards. You said you were considering buying their yourself so wanted to hear your thoughts on why Las Ventanas is ok but this location is a "pass".

shadax,

Most people don't understand mello roos, and the way it's advertised doesn't help.  Mello roos is based on square footage and only square footage.  Terms like effective rate and percentage of sales price is totally meaningless and misleading.  So you need to compare apples to apples by looking at square footage vs square footage, not sales price or tax rate.

Now, CS is significantly less the CG.

I looked into the details of the actual taxes being paid and that's only one of the special assessments, they each have different ones.  CS for example pays for the new school while CG doesn't, since only CS residents get to attend.

What does it matter if I'm poisoned, drowned, or shot? I'm still dead.  And no matter how it's explained, computed, or advertised, it's still $8,000 a year in taxes ABOVE the base property tax rate.  And that's still outrageous.

The only "problem" with advertising it the way they did is that I have to compute the additional yearly taxes on my own, based on the percentage they came up with...even if that's not how the taxes are determined.  They probably advertise it that way because they don't want to stick $8,000 per year on there. 

You're still not getting it.  $8k is not outrageous for a 3k sqft home.  Show me the mello roos for another 3k sqft home.  At least you're not buying the 4k sqft Gables model.  If you want to pay less mello roos then buy a smaller home or an older home.  Homes built in the 90's have a mello roos about half that.  Like I said, you need to compare apples to apples.

Homes in the 90s have a Mello Roos that's 1/4 or 1/5 that these guys are trying to charge.  $7k-$8k in Mello Roos for the pleasure of living on some marine base with toxic soil?  No thanks...PASS!

Let's see, given that I don't have to sign a disclosure stating that you can't plant any kind of trees, fruits, or vegetables kinda makes me think the dirt is a bit CONTAMINATED.  Secondly, I'm not looking to buy in Tustin.  Thirdly, I'm not looking to buy right by the railroad tracks.  Lastly, the super Mello Roos to buy a home that doesn't have a driveway is the last back breaker.  Btw, those Newport Coast homes by the landfill sure seem to be doing OK, don't they?  I'm not too concerned about fire danger over in Portola especially since those huge $1.4m+ homes and the toll road will provide a good shield if a fire does come. 

 

[test]

USC,

Interesting. how do you think this compares with las ventanas then given las ventanas is near land fill and near free way and has fire hazards. You said you were considering buying their yourself so wanted to hear your thoughts on why Las Ventanas is ok but this location is a "pass".

shadax,

Most people don't understand mello roos, and the way it's advertised doesn't help.  Mello roos is based on square footage and only square footage.  Terms like effective rate and percentage of sales price is totally meaningless and misleading.  So you need to compare apples to apples by looking at square footage vs square footage, not sales price or tax rate.

Now, CS is significantly less the CG.

I looked into the details of the actual taxes being paid and that's only one of the special assessments, they each have different ones.  CS for example pays for the new school while CG doesn't, since only CS residents get to attend.

What does it matter if I'm poisoned, drowned, or shot? I'm still dead.  And no matter how it's explained, computed, or advertised, it's still $8,000 a year in taxes ABOVE the base property tax rate.  And that's still outrageous.

The only "problem" with advertising it the way they did is that I have to compute the additional yearly taxes on my own, based on the percentage they came up with...even if that's not how the taxes are determined.  They probably advertise it that way because they don't want to stick $8,000 per year on there. 

You're still not getting it.  $8k is not outrageous for a 3k sqft home.  Show me the mello roos for another 3k sqft home.  At least you're not buying the 4k sqft Gables model.  If you want to pay less mello roos then buy a smaller home or an older home.  Homes built in the 90's have a mello roos about half that.  Like I said, you need to compare apples to apples.

Homes in the 90s have a Mello Roos that's 1/4 or 1/5 that these guys are trying to charge.  $7k-$8k in Mello Roos for the pleasure of living on some marine base with toxic soil?  No thanks...PASS!

Let's see, given that I don't have to sign a disclosure stating that you can't plant any kind of trees, fruits, or vegetables kinda makes me think the dirt is a bit CONTAMINATED.  Secondly, I'm not looking to buy in Tustin.  Thirdly, I'm not looking to buy right by the railroad tracks.  Lastly, the super Mello Roos to buy a home that doesn't have a driveway is the last back breaker.  Btw, those Newport Coast homes by the landfill sure seem to be doing OK, don't they?  I'm not too concerned about fire danger over in Portola especially since those huge $1.4m+ homes and the toll road will provide a good shield if a fire does come. 

What are you the left-wing media?  If you repeat a lie enough times it becomes true?  You don't even have your facts on mello roos correct.  You don't have your facts on anything correct.  Oh wait you went to USC, that explains it.

 

[shadax]

USC,

Interesting. how do you think this compares with las ventanas then given las ventanas is near land fill and near free way and has fire hazards. You said you were considering buying their yourself so wanted to hear your thoughts on why Las Ventanas is ok but this location is a "pass".

shadax,

Most people don't understand mello roos, and the way it's advertised doesn't help.  Mello roos is based on square footage and only square footage.  Terms like effective rate and percentage of sales price is totally meaningless and misleading.  So you need to compare apples to apples by looking at square footage vs square footage, not sales price or tax rate.

Now, CS is significantly less the CG.

I looked into the details of the actual taxes being paid and that's only one of the special assessments, they each have different ones.  CS for example pays for the new school while CG doesn't, since only CS residents get to attend.

What does it matter if I'm poisoned, drowned, or shot? I'm still dead.  And no matter how it's explained, computed, or advertised, it's still $8,000 a year in taxes ABOVE the base property tax rate.  And that's still outrageous.

The only "problem" with advertising it the way they did is that I have to compute the additional yearly taxes on my own, based on the percentage they came up with...even if that's not how the taxes are determined.  They probably advertise it that way because they don't want to stick $8,000 per year on there. 

You're still not getting it.  $8k is not outrageous for a 3k sqft home.  Show me the mello roos for another 3k sqft home.  At least you're not buying the 4k sqft Gables model.  If you want to pay less mello roos then buy a smaller home or an older home.  Homes built in the 90's have a mello roos about half that.  Like I said, you need to compare apples to apples.

Homes in the 90s have a Mello Roos that's 1/4 or 1/5 that these guys are trying to charge.  $7k-$8k in Mello Roos for the pleasure of living on some marine base with toxic soil?  No thanks...PASS!

Let's see, given that I don't have to sign a disclosure stating that you can't plant any kind of trees, fruits, or vegetables kinda makes me think the dirt is a bit CONTAMINATED.  Secondly, I'm not looking to buy in Tustin.  Thirdly, I'm not looking to buy right by the railroad tracks.  Lastly, the super Mello Roos to buy a home that doesn't have a driveway is the last back breaker.  Btw, those Newport Coast homes by the landfill sure seem to be doing OK, don't they?  I'm not too concerned about fire danger over in Portola especially since those huge $1.4m+ homes and the toll road will provide a good shield if a fire does come. 

What are you the left-wing media?  If you repeat a lie enough times it becomes true?  You don't even have your facts on mello roos correct.  You don't have your facts on anything correct.  Oh wait you went to USC, that explains it.

Ugh Test.........come on.  Maricopa at Stonegate has 3,000 sqft plans and the MR is $4,200 per year.  Can we stop this now

 

[LAtoOC]

I support the USC dig, but I have to agree on the following

1. An adjustable rate MR is ridiculous
2. Having to sign a waver about planting trees shows me that the MR was not spent on properly removing contaminated soil (maybe they should have checked out what happened in Playa Vista in LA on how to remove jet-fuel soil).

 

[shadax]

And $8,000 to live on the ghetto side of the base even!  I can't believe it.  I mean I took my mother (who is also an interested party when it comes to RE/new homes), she lives in Fountain Valley.  We made the mistake of taking Edinger all the way down.  the bario doesn't end THAT far from where CS begins.  Ick.

 

[usctrojancpa]

USC,

Interesting. how do you think this compares with las ventanas then given las ventanas is near land fill and near free way and has fire hazards. You said you were considering buying their yourself so wanted to hear your thoughts on why Las Ventanas is ok but this location is a "pass".

shadax,

Most people don't understand mello roos, and the way it's advertised doesn't help.  Mello roos is based on square footage and only square footage.  Terms like effective rate and percentage of sales price is totally meaningless and misleading.  So you need to compare apples to apples by looking at square footage vs square footage, not sales price or tax rate.

Now, CS is significantly less the CG.

I looked into the details of the actual taxes being paid and that's only one of the special assessments, they each have different ones.  CS for example pays for the new school while CG doesn't, since only CS residents get to attend.

What does it matter if I'm poisoned, drowned, or shot? I'm still dead.  And no matter how it's explained, computed, or advertised, it's still $8,000 a year in taxes ABOVE the base property tax rate.  And that's still outrageous.

The only "problem" with advertising it the way they did is that I have to compute the additional yearly taxes on my own, based on the percentage they came up with...even if that's not how the taxes are determined.  They probably advertise it that way because they don't want to stick $8,000 per year on there. 

You're still not getting it.  $8k is not outrageous for a 3k sqft home.  Show me the mello roos for another 3k sqft home.  At least you're not buying the 4k sqft Gables model.  If you want to pay less mello roos then buy a smaller home or an older home.  Homes built in the 90's have a mello roos about half that.  Like I said, you need to compare apples to apples.

Homes in the 90s have a Mello Roos that's 1/4 or 1/5 that these guys are trying to charge.  $7k-$8k in Mello Roos for the pleasure of living on some marine base with toxic soil?  No thanks...PASS!

Let's see, given that I don't have to sign a disclosure stating that you can't plant any kind of trees, fruits, or vegetables kinda makes me think the dirt is a bit CONTAMINATED.  Secondly, I'm not looking to buy in Tustin.  Thirdly, I'm not looking to buy right by the railroad tracks.  Lastly, the super Mello Roos to buy a home that doesn't have a driveway is the last back breaker.  Btw, those Newport Coast homes by the landfill sure seem to be doing OK, don't they?  I'm not too concerned about fire danger over in Portola especially since those huge $1.4m+ homes and the toll road will provide a good shield if a fire does come. 

What are you the left-wing media?  If you repeat a lie enough times it becomes true?  You don't even have your facts on mello roos correct.  You don't have your facts on anything correct.  Oh wait you went to USC, that explains it.

Then riddle me this...when the hell do they require potential buyers to sign that disclosure about not planting anything?  Last time I checked, the Irvine new home developers weren't requiring buyers to sign that (Woodbury, Stonegate, Portola Springs, Quail Hill, etc).  Sounds like the developer of is either trying to cover their own booty and/or they know something that we don't.  Either way....PASS!  GO TROJANS! 

 

[test]

I support the USC dig, but I have to agree on the following

1. An adjustable rate MR is ridiculous
2. Having to sign a waver about planting trees shows me that the MR was not spent on properly removing contaminated soil (maybe they should have checked out what happened in Playa Vista in LA on how to remove jet-fuel soil).

Where are you getting your information from?  Hopefully not USC!  There are plenty of trees planted at the model homes and throughout the community.

 

[usctrojancpa]

I support the USC dig, but I have to agree on the following

1. An adjustable rate MR is ridiculous
2. Having to sign a waver about planting trees shows me that the MR was not spent on properly removing contaminated soil (maybe they should have checked out what happened in Playa Vista in LA on how to remove jet-fuel soil).

Where are you getting your information from?  Hopefully not USC!  There are plenty of trees planted at the model homes and throughout the community.

Not regular trees, but fruit baring trees....you know like a lemon or orange tree.  I saw the disclosure because I had a friend who initially signed up to buy one of Lennar's condos in 2008 but then backed out.  Are you sure you don't work for Lennar or William Lyon???