Work situation?

[akula1488]

Personally I like to be in office for the free coffee and the view. The drive to work is also scenic.

I respect your feedback. Free coffee? Been there done that. Free coffee, drinks, snacks, alcohol, food. Meh, I dont really care about that. Things I look for growth opportunity, company culture, and of course money.

My company culture encourages a lot of in person cooperation. It is one the better known companies in California.

 

[eyephone]

Personally I like to be in office for the free coffee and the view. The drive to work is also scenic.

I respect your feedback. Free coffee? Been there done that. Free coffee, drinks, snacks, alcohol, food. Meh, I dont really care about that. Things I look for growth opportunity, company culture, and of course money.

My company culture encourages a lot of in person cooperation. It is one the better known companies in California.

Yeah it all depends on the industry and company.

 

[marmott]

Sure, but people do get to decide ultimately.

Not trying to nitpick, but people are invoking their ultimate choice by quitting as IHO pointed out in his original post / question.

And I get people's frustration with the teachers union in particular.

In NYC, the teachers received priority in getting vaccinated, but were the last hold outs on returning to in person teaching. Studies have shown that remote learning is 30%-70% less effective in content based learning. Parents are rightfully outraged.

Not sure if it's the same here in OC since my daughter is too young to go to school yet.

If this pandemic has changed people's mind on the work model they prefer I don't see how it makes them whiners. If they are willing to quit to keep the remote work model kudos to them, there are many reasons to want a job change and remote work is just one that is becoming more prevalent.

I'm not disputing the all teacher unions debacle, France managed to have all the kids back at school on January 4th 2021 and that was without widespread vaccination. Teachers strike on a regular basis in France but I did not hear much opposition to this when it was decided.

 

[qwerty]

For the most part white collar workers have worked their entire career going into the office, including the c-suites that make the rules. Now that people have gotten a taste of remote work, as that older c-suite gets turned over and replaced with the younger more progressive people, the hybrid model or remote work will be the norm. The job market will dictate that the hybrid model/remote work be offered by all companies otherwise you won?t get the talent.

 

[usctrojancpa]

I wonder what kind of effect most companies requiring their employees to come in 2-3 days a week will have on the housing market (aka the flight from urban areas to the suburbs).

 

[daedalus]

I can't imagine having to learn the ropes of my business remotely.  It's just too difficult.  Likewise, my effectiveness as a seasoned mentor is blunted.  Too many nuances that can't be communicated effectively with a screen share.  And sometimes the only way to get someone to stop ignoring emails and voicemails and jump through a required hoop is to go to their office and stand over their shoulder until they deal with it.  I have spoken to a number of people at work, and the opinion seems to be unanimous.  I think maybe the company is responding to candidate surveys from college kids the company is trying to recruit, and not listening to the new hires who already have the job.  At the end of the day, though, it'll only make me more valuable as time goes on, and I get to park a lot closer to the entrance, so I'm not going to complain too loudly.

 

[UrvineLegend]

Currently on remote, but have gone into office more than several times, and still no words on when we'll be called in.  For my job, I estimate that I need to be in office about half the times.  This remote working slows down progress of my projects somewhat.  My company just sent out a survey to all office people asking our preference on remote/in office work schedule.  I'm thinking of 2/3 hybrid schedule for myself.

 

[sleepy5136]

I think it?s funny how some companies are trying to act tough and are not listening to their employees on such a simple matter. They aren?t asking for raises, they are simply asking for the flexibility to work wherever they want. As far as I?m concerned, why should it matter where one works? As long as they do their job and commit to their deliveries they promised, there should be no issues.

It will be interesting how this all plays out. I think companies are quite stupid if they think WFH is worth losing out on great talent. My company seems to be flexible with being remote fully and coming in as needed.

 

[akula1488]

I think it?s funny how some companies are trying to act tough and are not listening to their employees on such a simple matter. They aren?t asking for raises, they are simply asking for the flexibility to work wherever they want. As far as I?m concerned, why should it matter where one works? As long as they do their job and commit to their deliveries they promised, there should be no issues.

It will be interesting how this all plays out. I think companies are quite stupid if they think WFH is worth losing out on great talent. My company seems to be flexible with being remote fully and coming in as needed.

A lot of company are paying salaries based on the zip code of the office location. That's why silicon Valley pays good compensation to offset the insane housing cost there.

 

[OCtoSV]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

 

[nosuchreality]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

Particularly dangerous for tech type, IMHO.  I can run a remote team from Czech, Romania, Ireland, India as readily as I can manage a team from at home in OC, Palo Alto, etc.  Initial sourcing is a pita, once done, sourcing then no more difficult than here.

I worked at IBM for a bit, they have successfully done WFH for decades. Make no mistake though, everybody WFH is a spreadsheet number.

 

[sleepy5136]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

This differs from each individual. There is no right or wrong answer to this. But putting out a blanket statement like that is quite harsh. You do know there are tons of stats saying that people work harder at home than in office right?

 

[nosuchreality]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

This differs from each individual. There is no right or wrong answer to this. But putting out a blanket statement like that is quite harsh. You do know there are tons of stats saying that people work harder at home than in office right?

Worker reported stats don?t mean anything, proof will be on the bottom line and if the org can get more done.

JIMHO, orgs should be able to get more done simply by WFH puts a neuter on shitshow instant reactionary crap. 

That said OCtoSV said a fundamental truth for corporate work.  If you are not establishing a personal relationship with the shakers, you?re just a contract cog.

 

[sleepy5136]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

This differs from each individual. There is no right or wrong answer to this. But putting out a blanket statement like that is quite harsh. You do know there are tons of stats saying that people work harder at home than in office right?

Worker reported stats don?t mean anything, proof will be on the bottom line and if the org can get more done.

JIMHO, orgs should be able to get more done simply by WFH puts a neuter on shitshow instant reactionary crap. 

That said OCtoSV said a fundamental truth for corporate work.  If you are not establishing a personal relationship with the shakers, you?re just a contract cog.

Being in tech that is simply not true. So it's definitely job specific. I rather let my technical skills do the talking and bring in my value from that than knowing how to kiss someones behind.

You're right, proof is the bottom line and is shown in tech earnings. Not sure if you're following tech earnings, but they are definitely outperforming. Hence their stock increase in 2020 despite the stupid narrative of dumping tech stocks because of rising interest rates.

 

[nosuchreality]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

This differs from each individual. There is no right or wrong answer to this. But putting out a blanket statement like that is quite harsh. You do know there are tons of stats saying that people work harder at home than in office right?

Worker reported stats don?t mean anything, proof will be on the bottom line and if the org can get more done.

JIMHO, orgs should be able to get more done simply by WFH puts a neuter on shitshow instant reactionary crap. 

That said OCtoSV said a fundamental truth for corporate work.  If you are not establishing a personal relationship with the shakers, you?re just a contract cog.

Being in tech that is simply not true. So it's definitely job specific. I rather let my technical skills do the talking and bring in my value from that than knowing how to kiss someones behind.

If you're not the one creating the idea for the product, the major design creator, you're just manufacturing fulfillment.

It's not *ss-kissing.  It's relationship.  It's established knowledge that you're the trustworthy competent 2nd tech opinion and eventually first opinion.

Good tech skills are hard to find, but they're still a commodity.

WFH, just makes the commoditization completely obvious and your competition directly global.

Make sure you're the top 5% doing the big picture work and not the widget work.

In other words, don't let your personal brand get commoditized.

 

[sleepy5136]

My career would be nowhere if I didn't prioritize F2F interaction with senior execs, all of whom have come back and we are trying to lead by example.

Prioritizing lifestyle over career will be noticed and not rewarded. But no one will mind WFH on Fridays. All about striking the right balance.

This differs from each individual. There is no right or wrong answer to this. But putting out a blanket statement like that is quite harsh. You do know there are tons of stats saying that people work harder at home than in office right?

Worker reported stats don?t mean anything, proof will be on the bottom line and if the org can get more done.

JIMHO, orgs should be able to get more done simply by WFH puts a neuter on shitshow instant reactionary crap. 

That said OCtoSV said a fundamental truth for corporate work.  If you are not establishing a personal relationship with the shakers, you?re just a contract cog.

Being in tech that is simply not true. So it's definitely job specific. I rather let my technical skills do the talking and bring in my value from that than knowing how to kiss someones behind.

If you're not the one creating the idea for the product, the major design creator, you're just manufacturing fulfillment.

It's not *ss-kissing.  It's relationship.  It's established knowledge that you're the trustworthy competent 2nd tech opinion and eventually first opinion.

Good tech skills are hard to find, but they're still a commodity.

WFH, just makes the commoditization completely obvious and your competition directly global.

Make sure you're the top 5% doing the big picture work and not the widget work.

In other words, don't let your personal brand get commoditized.

I would argue having good work ethic would be more important and in turn can make one trust your work and be the one to go to. It does not involve needing to be physically in the office to do that. I'm also not against building relationships, but don't stand up here telling me that it requires to be in office to do so. I'm not going to work to look for a wife or a companion...

As for WFH increasing competition sure, I prefer that as I would like to have the ones that aren't qualified weeded out.

 

[qwerty]

What is happening in this discussion is what I commented on earlier. Old school vs new school. As the younger 
sleepy5136 folks move up the mentality at the top will change, it?s only a matter of time.

Also, the key positions at companies are hard to get anyway, so even if you are the office full time there is no gaurantee that it will advance your career. The cream always rises. If the top performer is wfh that person will move up one way or another. 

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Hardest part for me going back into the office.. figuring out what's for lunch.

I'm too lazy to pack and bring anything every day and that's where WFH was convenient because if I didn't have enough time I could do lunch in 5-10 minutes from whatever was in the fridge/freezer... whereas now I have to get in the car and drive somewhere.

Also running errands, going to medical/dental appointments or having trades people over was much easier... I was an in-office worker proponent but now I actually prefer remote or hybrid. You work weird hours but that's the plus, you make your own schedule outside of mandatory meetings/calls you have to attend.

 

[daedalus]

I've been involved with an outsourcing project.  We had a contract with a programing shop in India.  Our project manager and his right hand man were both from India.  The entire thing was a shitshow.  For their part, the overseas workers were wonderful.  So eager to please, willing to put in crazy hours, time zones meant nothing, very responsive to requests/critiques, yadda yadda yadda.  But we were just too far apart in nuances.  The things we thought were most basic and which we never even thought to spell out were misconstrued, and they made assumptions based on what they thought was obvious.  I don't know if it was ethnic culture, or corporate culture, or both, but it was terrible.  Our programming costs dropped and our project management costs soared.  We were getting the results, but it took constant babysitting and a mind-numbing amount of iterations. I'm sure if we had stuck with it, we would have ended up with an acceptable solution for lower costs, but it wouldn't have been as user-approachable and our schedule did not allow it.  Managers get real antsy when a program is burning 10s of thousands of dollars an hour.  Based on that, and other things I've read, I'm not too worried about getting outsourced.  It's the guy in the next office over who's the threat.  But if we're #1 and #2, it doesn't really matter who's #1 and who's #2; we'll both always have jobs.

 

[Irvinehomeseeker]

Hardest part for me going back into the office.. figuring out what's for lunch.

I'm too lazy to pack and bring anything every day and that's where WFH was convenient because if I didn't have enough time I could do lunch in 5-10 minutes from whatever was in the fridge/freezer... whereas now I have to get in the car and drive somewhere.

Also running errands, going to medical/dental appointments or having trades people over was much easier... I was an in-office worker proponent but now I actually prefer remote or hybrid. You work weird hours but that's the plus, you make your own schedule outside of mandatory meetings/calls you have to attend.

100% agree with above!!

I am not eager to get back into office.  My company seems fine with WFH for the most part. They have seen productivity boost up. When surveyed, pretty much all  my team preferred wfh full time.