When, if ever, would you feel like a loser for being a renter?

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[quote author="Geotpf" date=1245644573][quote author="freedomCM" date=1245642598][quote author="usctrojanman29" date=1245616642]When the cost of renting is more than the cost of owning a home.</blockquote>


In a rational market.



(no maint, no tied-up dp, no insurance, no reserve fund for repairs, etc)</blockquote>


Maintenance, insurance, etc., are all "costs of owning a home".</blockquote>




Exactly my poing!!!



which is why renting should cost more than owning (as defined by PITI), no?
 
[quote author="traceimage" date=1245590147][quote author="awgee" date=1245589400]Huh? Why would my self view depend upon whether or not I was renting?







The question is too bizarre.</blockquote>


For some people, owning a home is a rite of passage of sorts...like graduating from college, buying a car, getting a job, etc. Some people don't feel they've "made it" if they don't own their own home by a certain point in their lives.</blockquote>


May I kindly suggest, that anyone thinking or feeling this way may greatly benefit by doing some serious introspection to determine by what measures one wants to be counted; what he/she has or what he/she contributes. Yeah, it sounds self-righteous and a bit uppity, but I do not know how else to put it.
 
[quote author="freedomCM" date=1245726706][quote author="Geotpf" date=1245644573][quote author="freedomCM" date=1245642598][quote author="usctrojanman29" date=1245616642]When the cost of renting is more than the cost of owning a home.</blockquote>


In a rational market.



(no maint, no tied-up dp, no insurance, no reserve fund for repairs, etc)</blockquote>


Maintenance, insurance, etc., are all "costs of owning a home".</blockquote>




Exactly my poing!!!



which is why renting should cost more than owning (as defined by PITI), no?</blockquote>


Not necessarily. Some people ONLY have those incidential costs (that is, they own the house free and clear). You can get the best rental deals from them, because they have no pressure to try to make a mortgage payment.



But then again, sometimes people only need a place to live for a temporary amount of time, or don't have the credit score, steady, provable income, or a downpayment to get a loan. Of course, during the bubble, one did not need a good credit score, steady, provable income, or a downpayment to get a loan.



Plus, if people are willing to buy property even if their costs are way above rental parity, demand is artificially high. There are some non-financial reasons to buy even if renting is cheaper (you can modify and decorate the house however you want to, no landlord looking over your shoulder, plus the "pride of ownership" signifying "you've made it").



In short, I don't think there's any magic reason whether or not purchasing a propetry should be above or below rental parity. I think "every market is different" in this case. For example, I imagine places with lots of people who only need short term housing (say, near colleges) buying would typically be below rental parity (because demand for rental units is artifically high due to all the college students). Places where lots of people have poor credit, low savings, or unsteady income would be the same (lots of people who can't qualify to get a mortgage, so more renters than normal).
 
<strong>Myself </strong>



<em>I have to live with myself, and so

I want to be fit for myself to know,

I want to be able, as the days go by,

Always to look myself straight in the eye;

I don?t want to stand, with the setting sun,

And hate myself for the things I have done.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



I don?t want to keep on a closet shelf

A lot of secrets about myself,

And fool myself, as I come and go,

Into thinking that nobody else will know

The kind of man I really am;

I don?t want to dress up myself in sham.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I want to go out with my head erect,

I want to deserve all men?s respect;

But here in the struggle for fame and pelf

I want to be able to like myself.

I don?t want to look at myself and know

That I?m bluster and bluff and empty show.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I can never hide myself from me;

I see what others may never see;

I know what others may never know,

I never can fool myself, and so,

Whatever happens, I want to be

Self-respecting and conscience free.</em>



By Edgar A. Guest
 
[quote author="awgee" date=1245727432][quote author="traceimage" date=1245590147][quote author="awgee" date=1245589400]Huh? Why would my self view depend upon whether or not I was renting?







The question is too bizarre.</blockquote>


For some people, owning a home is a rite of passage of sorts...like graduating from college, buying a car, getting a job, etc. Some people don't feel they've "made it" if they don't own their own home by a certain point in their lives.</blockquote>


May I kindly suggest, that anyone thinking or feeling this way may greatly benefit by doing some serious introspection to determine by what measures one wants to be counted; what he/she has or what he/she contributes. Yeah, it sounds self-righteous and a bit uppity, but I do not know how else to put it.</blockquote>


I don't think you sound uppity...maybe a little self-righteous, but thanks for the comment. You are right that everyone has to decide for themselves how they want to be judged, for lack of a better word. Some people need a fancy purse or an expensive car to feel successful. Other people might just be proud of their personal accomplishments, like building a business or finishing grad school or helping the poor or whatever. For some people, home ownership might qualify as an accomplishment, especially if they've been saving for a long time. In any case, to each their own.
 
I believe there was a Simpsons episode where the aliens Kang and Kodos disguised themselves as two tract homes.



Homer: Take a good look at your beloved luxury mansions! They're nothing but hideous tract homes! [rips off facade from cheap housing development to reveal giant green aliens]



[Gasps and screams from the homebuying public]



Aliens: It's true... we are overpriced stucco boxes. But what are you going to do about it?? You have to buy some home...



Crowd: [murmurs amongst themselves] They're right, we have to buy some home!



Random man in crowd: Well, I do believe I will rent for the time being...



Aliens: Go ahead... throw away your rent money! BWAHAHAHAH!



<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVW3-PQ0tFU">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVW3-PQ0tFU</a>
 
I wanted a house for many reasons, none of which were that I felt like a loser for renting. If anything, I had more to brag about my rental if I wanted to share the obscenely low rent I paid for a highly sought after location. Oddly enough, my husband seems to take a lot of pride in the properties we co-own with the bank, which is not something I would have ever thought would be the case.



Once we got married my desire for own home stirred its ugly little head. I had been saving for many years with the idea that this was a DP fund, but wasn't motivated to actually buy anything. One of my best friends and fomer roommate at the awesome rental felt the need to do it before she got priced out forever and settled on something that was less than she wanted in Jan '04. She's a very pragmatic woman and one of the striking things she said while she was out and out searching for something in her price range is "there were a lot of things that I pictured doing on my own, but buying a house was not one of them."



She wanted homeownership as a right of passage, but thought it would be done with a partner. Since she hadn't met him yet, and RE was going up like mad, she felt the need to do it on her own. I felt so bad and didn't really understand at the time why she felt this pressure from within to buy a place. It was a benchmark for her.



For me it wasn't a benchmark, but once hubby and I were engaged, something changed in me. I no longer thought that if given the chance I would up and move to another country, stopped day dreaming about this care free life and my desire to create a nice home for us kicked in. Buying the houses was more about having our home be a reflection of our values and desires.



While I know that our timing on the houses could have been a lot better for us financially, they have also given us so much and brought us even closer than we were. In a way, the houses grounded both of us who were wandering spirits before we met, two people who never felt certain that the path society and parents say you should be on is really the path you will take.



Frankly, I'm not proud of the house we live in as something that I would want people I'm not close with to know about. My husband, on the other hand, is full of pride and I'm so pleased to see his sense of achievement that he gets from them. I'll have to post the pictures of the arbor he built because not only is it just phenomenal, but these are the kinds of things that I never thought my husband had the slightest desire to do.
 
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