Villages of Columbus - Columbus Square - Camden Place

NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
hehe, this is getting more and more entertaining... and more and more off the topic... i don't work for lennar and even if i would what differnce would it make, not sure what asianinvasion does but he promotes all homes, not just lyon... but i don't really care. i use this forum for entertainment. i certainly won't make any decisions based on some bored/frustrated renters/homeowners...



maybe we can get back on the topic of camden place...
 
I think HOA fees have risen because of all the vacate lots. With there being less residents living in VOC than projected, the community costs have to be spread among fewer residents. I guess that's another risk that you must take when buying into a new development.
 
Ok, back to Camden Place.



Accoding to the website, only Plan two are left. Their own calculator, prominently displayed on the model web page, DOES NOT include any spaces for HOA, etc. It does have a mortgage insurance field that fills in automatically if the down is too low, as well as spots for property taxes and homeowner's insurance.



When I plugged in the numbers, assuming a $400k purchase price (the default), $80k down, 6% fixed rate /30 yr. mortgage, property taxes of $4000/yr., homeowners insurance of $1500/yr., and the monthly payment is $2,376.



I have looked at each of the plans extensively, and Plan Two is the least desirable for me, simply because the third floor is a bit crowded compared to the others. That said, these are VERY NICE condos - at least the models are, and come fully loaded. The location is fantastic, and IF the price were really $400k, a deal.



When a new development is almost built out, all there is to talk about are very important issues like HOA fee fluctuations, construction defects, and the progress of landscaping, communituy amenity construction. Prospective buyers SHOULD be made aware of these issues, so that they may choose KNOWLEDGABLY if Camden is the place for them.



Now, since we are back to the topic - Camden Place - can anyone accurately break down the actual non-mortgage costs that a prosepective buyer may expect to pay TODAY? I know what I was told when I was considering purchasing one last year, but that is obviously different than what people are actually paying now.



Once again, this is ON TOPIC, for prospective buyers - and highly relevant. I could care less who works for who or what people's motives are. If current owners are posting here, please let us know what you are paying in non-mortgage costs, and if you are also having issues with fixtures, floors, etc.



Shooby, myfirsthome, Perspective, mraoki1, etc. gave us some great info before I started yapping about Costa Mesa - thanks!!
 
Plan 2 is the only one with the bedrooms on the same floor. Unless you are planning to rent out rooms having one bedroom on each floor is the least desireable and a pain if you are raising a family. Not to mention plan 2 is also the only one with a kitchen island.
 
<p>asianinvasion,</p>

<p>Plan Two also has a very roomy middle floor, although the "balcony" is kind of an afterthought. It is a great kitchen - in fact, all of the Camden units have great kitchens.</p>

<p>I like the privacy and roominess of the third floor in plans one and three - PLUS, I really like the bathroom downstairs in those two. I don't have kids, so that may impact my opinion.</p>

<p> </p>

<p> </p>
 
Are there any phases left for Camden Place? We saw a listing for plan 3 today on sale for $489,000. When we visited the model homes a few weeks ago, the sales person said they were sold out for the time being and didn't say whether they were planning to build more. Does anyone know? If so, we may be interested in purchasing here in the future.
 
yes there is more coming, but it might be a while, lennar - just like other builders - is pulling the brakes on building new homes, maybe someone heard a date but i would guess not before late summer
 
I'm interested to see if their prices stay the same. We can wait until summer or even longer to purchase. My realtor, who is also a friend, says he thinks prices will go down a little bit more by summertime.
 
"Can anyone accurately break down the actual non-mortgage costs?"



Your estimate of a $1,500 yearly ins cost is exaggerated. Remember, Camden Place is a condo complex, so your HOA dues cover insurance for the structure. I own a Plan 3, and for a $50,000 policy covering interior contents, we pay just about $500 annually. But I think you understated the taxes since they?re advertised as effectively 1.8% due to mello-roos.



At these prices (I paid more of course ?), the rental equivalent cost is very near break-even considering taxes. This assumes your marginal Fed rate is 25% or higher. Calculate the home mortgage int and property taxes you?ll pay in the first year, and reduce it by 34% (25% Fed + 9% State). Add HOAs ($300 +/-) and ins ($50), and then compare this to other equivalent rentals.



I compared this cost to Villa Siena?s townhomes with attached 2-car garages, and there was a slight (less than 10%) premium to own at Camden Place. The price reductions since have negated this premium for prospective buyers.



This makes watching future pricing at Camden Place very interesting. For households earning into six figures, current pricing makes sense. So how far might Camden Place pricing ?over-correct??
 
I agree with perspective's analysis, to break it down



$189 camden hoa

$110 - $210 Community hoa

$45 condo insurance

$495 prop tax (reduced by 34%, assuming $500K and 1.8% est tax rate, however! i'd like to point out that mello roos is not calculated on a % basis, rather it's determined either by bedrooms or sq ft, i'd like to see the doc myself but i haven't been able to find. that being said, as prices decrease, propery tax (including mello roos) will increase on a percentage basis given that the mello roos is a set amount, hence, some developments in costa mesa are above 2%! and the developer was forced to buy down the rate)



so max non-mortgage, per month, is going to be $939.



Add that to your mortgage, assuming 20% down on $500K, approx $3500 housing payment, not including your utilities including hd-dvr which will add about $200 per month.



So i calculate about $3700 per month in housing expenses alone. But i like round numbers so lets get to $4000 in monthly housing by adding the minimum payments on the $9000 in furniture and flat screen you financed at 0% interest for 1 year, but still need to make minimum payments of approx $300 per month.



So we are at $4000 multiply that by 12 months which gets us $48K. Assuming that we are all prudent and are spending 1/3 of gross income on housing, that puts us at an appropriate household income of $144K. Now if we take a look at that number and multiply that by this number here, we get numerous distressed loans and foreclosures within a few years.
 
You don't think people make $144k on average? Myabe not, but you can make it with $100k. I doubt there will be much foreclosure in this community. I don't see it go down by too much anymore AND poeple are buying during a time when there's a lot of foreclosure, therefore I assume they are more cautious owners.
 
I know for a fact that the median household income in tustin is way less than $144K, more like $60K, can't speak for this community though. Yeah, last comment was for shock value, however, the more i think about it, the more pessimistic i become. Hmmm, I don't know if there's such thing as a cautious first time homeowner, the residents i know seemed compelled to buy (prior to price reductons) because they just got married or were married and had a kid. Emotion drove most of these purchases, and I doubt the majority of these purchasers are as knowledgeable about real estate as the participants in this forum are. furthermore, the economy is headed downwards and a good many of these people have commission based income. If they based their ability to afford a home on their income for last year, top o the market, than they are in for some tough times.



Going back to buying to prior to price reductions, I know a majority of the people in Camden 1 bought when there weren't many foreclosures, I really think many of them bought with option arms and 100% financing. But, I still have to agree that there won't be many foreclosures. I'm going to guess that given that many people are young, their parents are still around and that they will have financial backing from their parents in case things turn for the worse.
 
<p><em>I know for a fact that the median household income in tustin is way less than $144K, more like $60K</em></p>

<p>Median income in 92782 is $86K.</p>

<p> </p>
 
"I know a majority of the people in Camden 1 bought when there weren't many foreclosures, I really think many of them bought with option arms and 100% financing."



I thought it was pretty funny when the UAMC reps expected that I'd want an interest-only period at least. They also kept quoting rates for stated income loans. They wanted those loans due to the higher spreads. Unfortunately for them, I just wanted a plain 'ole 30 year fixed mortgage with documentation.



My neighbor in a Plan 3 rents the first floor bedroom for what he says is $800. That sounds like a lot for such a small bedroom. But that's how he helps pay his mortgage.
 
"I doubt the majority of these purchasers are as knowledgeable about real estate as the participants in this forum are"



with the exception of asianinvasion. what are you trying to prove? Aoki stated Tustin wide avg income, and yet you try to correct with googled and outdated information from city-data.com
 
i don't know about camden but another builder just called and they dropped their price about 6% plus another 9% in incentives. i am sure lennar will lower the price more and more as the time goes by and they start having standing inventory. merriweather already had one go back to the bank. only time will tell if camden resident will be able to hold on to their house.
 
Been dealing with Lennar the past two weeks and just signed for one of the last residence 3's from Phase 11. UAMC approved us for a 30 year fixed @ 5.75%, but since we have until June to lock in, methinks I'm gonna shop around and see if i can't score 5.25%. That wonderful $25K in incentives is long gone, as it was explained to me, only good last year october to bring up sales before Lennar's 11/30 year end. Only incentive right now is the $6k towards closing costs.



FYI - the sales rep lady had mentioned there are going to MAJOR changes in Phase 12. Along with some structural changes, the cosmetic changes are:



Jetted tub in the master bath will only be a normal tub, no jets.

Not pre-wired for a security system anymore

All units WILL not come with a refrigerator

Microwave/range, while still included will be one class lower on the G/E product list



I think thats mainly it, apparently the builder wanted to cut down on some costs, and in fighting to keep the granite and maple cabinetry, the features above with thrown on the chopping block. I would imagine the price would come down, but she didnt give me any indication of how much, or even at all.



Question for you peeps:



-How much are you spending on flooring? My wife and I were thinking porcelain tiles in the kitchen, and hardwood in the living areas, and carpet in the bedroom. Perusing the design center website hasnt really given me any indication of cost, but the sales lady was saying a good hardwood/tile combo would be around $20k. Too high/low?





Quick gripe:



Media niche in the second floor, WAY too small, isnt it? Got a 58 inch plasma and it looks like I have to install over the fireplace. Did anyone else have to do this?
 
Thanks for the update on the changes to their sales program, that's interesting news. i've seen more than a few neighbors with a plasma to big for the niche and it was hung over the fireplace. I personally don't like that setup as the screen isn't at eye level. Also, need to cut into dry wall and run cables through to outlet and cable connection. Plus, what are you going to do with that empty media nitch? build in a 7K book case or try to hide it with shelves from target?
 
<p>What do you think the prices will be like for Camden by the end of 2008? I have a friend who makes 160k as a pharmacist. He has no school loans, no car loans, and no credit card debts. Yeah, his parents paid for his pharmacy school. So now, he's paying 60K a year in taxes because he has absolutely no deductions other than maxing out his 401k. I advised him that he should spend a third of his income on housing, so that should roughly be $4400/month. Thus, he's looking to buy a place for $650K. And being that he's single and in his 20's, I'm recommending that he buys a newly built condo. Is this good advice? He'll probably buy by August. Also, although I still expect prices to drop for the rest of 2008, I don't think it will drop much in 09 or 2010. Does that make sense too? I truly think the biggest price drops would have occurred in 07 and 08. Perhaps 200K from the peak.</p>
 
Your flooring costs sound about right. This was my flooring cost using vintage design.



38K - hardwood downstairs. Roughly 2000 sqft downstairs.

8K - upgraded carpet upstairs



You're going to pay a premium using vintage design, but I had no choice considering it was quick-move in and I was using incentive money. I'm very happy with the work from vintage design. Top notch and great customer service.
 
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