homer_simpson
Well-known member
rkp said:
Yep lol
San Mateo Phase 2++ @ Stonegate
- Thread starter snut100
- Start date
NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
Yep lol
And I do worry about my online TI persona being compromised as I do post a lot... I don't think builders will be able to figure me out because I try to stay anonymous although once you see me... it's hard to ignore me.
Good hint on keeping your online secret identity from builders... don't use your real name or initials as a screen name (the PatStar Effect).
Other reasons are probably so they just have to deal with one point of contact.
From what I remember... tile flooring is actually reasonable from the design center... they usually have some tile that the builder bought in bulk that they can give you at a "discount". Does the design center even give you a choice of linoleum anymore? Saw an open house recently and it had the "classic" look... white walls, basic carpet, tile counters... and linoleum... in the kitchen and baths. That was surprising to me because you would think that they would have at least had tile installed in the last 14 or so years (house was built in the late 90s I think).
one of the reasons we are looking to buy new construction is for the convenience of picking what you want and not having to go through a remodel. if im going to buy a new home and do a bunch of stuff to it after the fact i may as well buy resale and remodel it. not all things are a ripoff, the biggest culprit seems to be flooring. but the idea of buying a new house, close, tear out the floor, pay another two weeks of rent, deal with another contractor, etc. that is just too much effort. If i get ripped off by 10K because i went with the builders flooring options so be it. if you are buying an 800-900K house and sweating over another 10-15K that the builder is ripping you off by then you probably shouldnt be buying that house.
San Marcos still comes with linoleum in the kitchen, bath and laundry. I actually prefer linoleum, since it's easier to rip out/lay over than tile. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but even if I can afford a 800~900K house, 10~15K is still a lot of dough to just throw away. 2 extra weeks of rent/mortgage plus contractor headaches is not something I would pay 10~15K for.
agree, buyers wont care. the person buying knows this going into it, they are paying for convenience. if all you are concerned about is resale, the more important question is whether you should be buying right now. Correct me if im wrong but one of the rules of thumb for homebuyers is not buy in a low rate environment because if rates go up you are SOL as a reseller. there are too many unknowns in the future to really care about whether you will recover 10-15K 5-7 years from now.
If you plan to be in the home for a while, affordability is more important than low rates or low prices.
But with rates this low, it's very hard not to buy because you are borrowing for almost nothing counting in inflation and tax breaks.
To me it's all like the chicken/egg thing. Did rates go down because people weren't buying? Did prices go down because people weren't buying? Did inventory go down because prices are going down? With so many variables in play... no one can really even call bottom because how can it be with interest so low? So rather than wait for rates to go up to 5/6 again... and hope prices go down (which they didn't when rates were 5/6)... just buy what you can afford.
Yep lol
irvinehomeowner
Well-known member
Only us nerds.rkp said:
And I do worry about my online TI persona being compromised as I do post a lot... I don't think builders will be able to figure me out because I try to stay anonymous although once you see me... it's hard to ignore me.
Good hint on keeping your online secret identity from builders... don't use your real name or initials as a screen name (the PatStar Effect).
iacrenter
Well-known member
Wow such negative reviews for the buying process. I should not be surprised. When you have a monopoly, you can treat your customers like $h*t and they keep coming back for more. Hopefully LR/TNHC and the future Great Park development will force TIC to improve their customer buying experience. What a shame. If TIC really wanted to squeeze more profit out of their home building unit, they need to fire whoever is in charge of their design center.
usctrojancpa
Well-known member
The buyers that keep coming to TIC/IP remind of a quote from some movie...."yes sir, may I have another (whipping)" haha Given the high margins on the upgrades, TIC/IP is leaving a lot of money on the table. Maybe they should just stick to what they know how to do best....build apartments and get more Irvine land ready to sell to homebuilders who know how to run a design center.iacrenter said:
The Motor Court Company
Well-known member
knowing most of the design upgrades are ripoffs, why do new home buyers even waste time in the design center? just pick from the limited standard options, do the upgrades after closing by using reputable contractors referred by USC or some other experienced forum members, and save major $$$. Actually you may get a better selection and customer service from outside contractors.
irvinehomeowner
Well-known member
Most of the time it's because they don't have money left after a down payment. And it's not like you can get instant HELOCs now like during the bubble.The Motor Court Company said:
Other reasons are probably so they just have to deal with one point of contact.
From what I remember... tile flooring is actually reasonable from the design center... they usually have some tile that the builder bought in bulk that they can give you at a "discount". Does the design center even give you a choice of linoleum anymore? Saw an open house recently and it had the "classic" look... white walls, basic carpet, tile counters... and linoleum... in the kitchen and baths. That was surprising to me because you would think that they would have at least had tile installed in the last 14 or so years (house was built in the late 90s I think).
qwerty
Well-known member
The Motor Court Company said:
one of the reasons we are looking to buy new construction is for the convenience of picking what you want and not having to go through a remodel. if im going to buy a new home and do a bunch of stuff to it after the fact i may as well buy resale and remodel it. not all things are a ripoff, the biggest culprit seems to be flooring. but the idea of buying a new house, close, tear out the floor, pay another two weeks of rent, deal with another contractor, etc. that is just too much effort. If i get ripped off by 10K because i went with the builders flooring options so be it. if you are buying an 800-900K house and sweating over another 10-15K that the builder is ripping you off by then you probably shouldnt be buying that house.
usctrojancpa
Well-known member
The highest margin ripoffs through the builder would have to be wood flooring (tile and carpet upgrades arent that bad), upgraded baseboards, crown moldings, ceiling fans, and window coverings. Cabinet upgrades, granite upgrades, recessed lighting, any kind of wiring, additional cabinets, door upgrades, loft/room upgrades, etc tend to be a wash or a little more expensive than doing it after the home is built.The Motor Court Company said:
irvinehomeowner said:
San Marcos still comes with linoleum in the kitchen, bath and laundry. I actually prefer linoleum, since it's easier to rip out/lay over than tile. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but even if I can afford a 800~900K house, 10~15K is still a lot of dough to just throw away. 2 extra weeks of rent/mortgage plus contractor headaches is not something I would pay 10~15K for.
Totally agree. Some ppl want convenience and will pay for it. The only thing I would never recommend and do thru the builder is landscaping/hardscaping. Otherwise, the other stuff, I understand going with the builder. Yeah, it's more expensive, sometimes obscenely so, but lots of ppl just wanna move in and be done with it. The average buyer probably spends about 5-10% of the purchase price on upgrades, not counting landscaping. That 5-10% shouldn't be a problem if a buyer has budgeted correctly. If it's a matter of principle of not wanting to give TIC more money, well then that's another issue entirely.qwerty said:
The Motor Court Company
Well-known member
at resale time, I doubt buyers will care whether it is builder upgrade or after market upgrade; so that's a hefty premium for convenience.
OCgasman said:
i think it really depends on how much of a premium it is and how much you are remodeling. if its just floors and counters for a few $1000 more, then i probably would go through the builder. if its extensive and will cost $20K more, i probably will do it after the fact. between rent, finding the right vendors, and project managing it, a few $1000, even $5000 to not have that hassle seems ok to me. it just comes down to peoples personal preferences.
we tend to get 5-7 quotes on everything and i have friends who get 3 and are satisfied while other friends dont do any research and buy on the spot
we tend to get 5-7 quotes on everything and i have friends who get 3 and are satisfied while other friends dont do any research and buy on the spot
qwerty
Well-known member
The Motor Court Company said:
agree, buyers wont care. the person buying knows this going into it, they are paying for convenience. if all you are concerned about is resale, the more important question is whether you should be buying right now. Correct me if im wrong but one of the rules of thumb for homebuyers is not buy in a low rate environment because if rates go up you are SOL as a reseller. there are too many unknowns in the future to really care about whether you will recover 10-15K 5-7 years from now.
Convenience is always expensive. Staying ski-in/ski-out vs one mile away from the slopes, paying extra to skip the long lines at amusement parks, chartered vs commercial flying, "VIP" parking...etc. It depends on if it's "worth" it to the individual. I would never do some of the upgrades from a builder, but also understand the buyer that does.The Motor Court Company said:
the conversation on resale brings up a good point. i think too many people on TI think about who their future buyer will be. i know IHS wrote a lot about this but i think its a wrong approach. we have seen beautiful houses that had we bought, we would change the flooring, the kitchen, and a host of other things. that money would never be recovered but we will enjoy that style much more. if everything is done for resale, everyone will live in boring houses
i still give props to that tahiti house in tustin ranch or WI cause those people made their house something they enjoyed....
i still give props to that tahiti house in tustin ranch or WI cause those people made their house something they enjoyed....
irvinehomeowner
Well-known member
bones brought up another reason people use the design center... design credits.
usctrojancpa
Well-known member
Not with TIC/IP...they don't believe in giving those to buyers. hahairvinehomeowner said:
i dont think tic/ip is smart enough to figure out who i am... and if they knew i dont care. im still not happy...
we spent some money and upgrades and here was our rationale:
floors - i've always heard floors are a rip off, but i think its relative. quoted our flooring outside and it was generally $2-3K cheaper for the downstairs. We decided to go with convenience and stuck with the builder. For the upstairs, carpet/tile - the price/sqft was outrageous, but the overall dollar amount was reasonable so I just went with it. For example, a bathroom was spec'd at 125 sq ft and the tile was 1800 which works out to 14+ per sq ft which is insane...
appliances - cheap to upgrade and didnt want to do any tearing out/replacing
cabinets - spent $5K on cabinet upgrades, but figured I'd spend way beyond that replacing.
counters/ baths - we spent a good chunk of money there because i dont want to go through any demo/remodel projects any time soon. Over $10K spent in counters but figure it'd be about the same if i did outside. (you get credit for the granite in the kitchen)
alot of the other stuff - wiring (i.e. recessed lights), baseboards, softclose was done out of convenience more than anything else.
I'm not mad about the money we spent, just the process involved to spend it...
we spent some money and upgrades and here was our rationale:
floors - i've always heard floors are a rip off, but i think its relative. quoted our flooring outside and it was generally $2-3K cheaper for the downstairs. We decided to go with convenience and stuck with the builder. For the upstairs, carpet/tile - the price/sqft was outrageous, but the overall dollar amount was reasonable so I just went with it. For example, a bathroom was spec'd at 125 sq ft and the tile was 1800 which works out to 14+ per sq ft which is insane...
appliances - cheap to upgrade and didnt want to do any tearing out/replacing
cabinets - spent $5K on cabinet upgrades, but figured I'd spend way beyond that replacing.
counters/ baths - we spent a good chunk of money there because i dont want to go through any demo/remodel projects any time soon. Over $10K spent in counters but figure it'd be about the same if i did outside. (you get credit for the granite in the kitchen)
alot of the other stuff - wiring (i.e. recessed lights), baseboards, softclose was done out of convenience more than anything else.
I'm not mad about the money we spent, just the process involved to spend it...
irvinehomeowner
Well-known member
I'm not sure if that's a rule of thumb or just Larry's rule.qwerty said:
If you plan to be in the home for a while, affordability is more important than low rates or low prices.
But with rates this low, it's very hard not to buy because you are borrowing for almost nothing counting in inflation and tax breaks.
To me it's all like the chicken/egg thing. Did rates go down because people weren't buying? Did prices go down because people weren't buying? Did inventory go down because prices are going down? With so many variables in play... no one can really even call bottom because how can it be with interest so low? So rather than wait for rates to go up to 5/6 again... and hope prices go down (which they didn't when rates were 5/6)... just buy what you can afford.