Regular vs "Zero" Grout Lines

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[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1253849830]In my next home (and hopefully my last)... I would do wood in the living areas (if only they made bamboo that looked better... eco-friendly!) and stone in the high-traffic areas.



My kids actually complain about the last and current home because the entire downstairs is hard flooring... the house before that had carpet in most of the living areas and they commented that the old house was "softer".



I actually like the matching grout on Mojo's tile... in retrospect, I think we should have done the same... does anyone knows what it costs to regrout? Heh.</blockquote>
It's not too expensive, just takes a little labor to strip the existing grout out. You want to buy the sanded grout because it's easier to work with.
 
[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1253849830]In my next home (and hopefully my last)... I would do wood in the living areas (if only they made bamboo that looked better... eco-friendly!) and stone in the high-traffic areas.



My kids actually complain about the last and current home because the entire downstairs is hard flooring... the house before that had carpet in most of the living areas and they commented that the old house was "softer".



I actually like the matching grout on Mojo's tile... in retrospect, I think we should have done the same... does anyone knows what it costs to regrout? Heh.</blockquote>


I've heard a lot of bad things from people who went with bamboo. Apparently its reputation for being soft (it is, in fact, a reed and not a wood) is understated. It gets dented all the time, and just pray that no one with heels or any stiff-bottomed shoe walks into your place. You also have to take into account tables, chairs, stools, bookcases, etc. leaving divits behind when they are moved.



regarding its looks, i've seen many stains and some look great (in someone else's home!... ;) )
 
[quote author="MojoJD" date=1253862993][quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1253849830]In my next home (and hopefully my last)... I would do wood in the living areas (if only they made bamboo that looked better... eco-friendly!) and stone in the high-traffic areas.



My kids actually complain about the last and current home because the entire downstairs is hard flooring... the house before that had carpet in most of the living areas and they commented that the old house was "softer".



I actually like the matching grout on Mojo's tile... in retrospect, I think we should have done the same... does anyone knows what it costs to regrout? Heh.</blockquote>


I've heard a lot of bad things from people who went with bamboo. Apparently its reputation for being soft (it is, in fact, a reed and not a wood) is understated. It gets dented all the time, and just pray that no one with heels or any stiff-bottomed shoe walks into your place. You also have to take into account tables, chairs, stools, bookcases, etc. leaving divits behind when they are moved.



regarding its looks, i've seen many stains and some look great (in someone else's home!... ;) )</blockquote>
Stick with maple, rosewood, or mahogany if you want wood flooring.
 
[quote author="MojoJD" date=1253864192]What about engineered wood? Is it REALLY different once you get it all laid down?</blockquote>
That's what I'm talking about...engineering wood. The best thing to do with it is to glue it down using Bastik's Best adhesive. The real hardwood floor is 3/4 of an inch thick and you have to nail it down.
 
The selection of materials should be consistent with the style of architecture. A modern industrial loft would be odd with travertine or a vintage colonial may not blend well with engineered wood flooring. The interior of a home and the exterior should compliment one another. The level of interior spec should match the building type as well. Don't over spend on expensive interior finishes for an attached home because it is like putting a polished mahogany dash board on a Geo Metro.



When I toured the Watermarke model homes I almost puked when I saw the Louis XIV french paneling and Versaille like finishes on a for sale apartment.



Model homes are too overly staged and to a point cluttered with too many craps hanging on walls. After a while the interiors look like a Cost Plus, Pier One, and TJ Maxx Home Goods stores.



Why couldn't designers decorate the space like how real people should live?
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1253881623]The selection of materials should be consistent with the style of architecture. A modern industrial loft would be odd with travertine or a vintage colonial may not blend well with engineered wood flooring. The interior of a home and the exterior should compliment one another. </blockquote>


Are you saying that a vintage colonial should have real hardwood flooring instead of engineered wood flooring because of the "feel" of nailed hardwood vs. glued engineering flooring or because hardwood flooring comes in narrow sizes like 2" strips that engineered flooring doesn't have? Other than the "feel" and the narrow sizes of real hardwood I thought that you could not tell hardwood flooring from engineered wood flooring once it is installed?



I'm almost certain to go with hardwood flooring throughout in my next and hopefully last house but am undecided about using real hardwood or an engineerered wood floor. I'm leaning towards the look of matte hand distressed planks and I can get the same look in real hardwood or engineered wood and am wondering if people can distinguish between the two after installation.
 
go engineered. they stand up to moderade abuse very well, especially with all the new water-tight interlocking cuts and anti-warp/swell underlayers. That, and it will cost you MUCH less for install and repairs.



besides, you'll save some old growth trees in the process. mahogany is my favorite wood, but i feel guilty when I buy it because its straight-up rainforest wood.
 
Yeah... that's the benefits of engineered, less worry about moisture because of the different sub-material and you can install them floating like laminates to save on installation headaches.



I like the darker distressed look (not too dark... more like a walnut) because it hides dirt and scuffs better ("Oh don't worry about that scratch... it's distressed.").
 
[quote author="fumbling" date=1253884742][quote author="bkshopr" date=1253881623]The selection of materials should be consistent with the style of architecture. A modern industrial loft would be odd with travertine or a vintage colonial may not blend well with engineered wood flooring. The interior of a home and the exterior should compliment one another. </blockquote>


Are you saying that a vintage colonial should have real hardwood flooring instead of engineered wood flooring because of the "feel" of nailed hardwood vs. glued engineering flooring or because hardwood flooring comes in narrow sizes like 2" strips that engineered flooring doesn't have? Other than the "feel" and the narrow sizes of real hardwood I thought that you could not tell hardwood flooring from engineered wood flooring once it is installed?



I'm almost certain to go with hardwood flooring throughout in my next and hopefully last house but am undecided about using real hardwood or an engineered wood floor. I'm leaning towards the look of matte hand distressed planks and I can get the same look in real hardwood or engineered wood and am wondering if people can distinguish between the two after installation.</blockquote>


There is no substitution for the look of real wood. Don't look at wood samples or floor at a perpendicular view. Always look at any wood floor at an angle reflecting the light source from a distant window or french door. Fake wood would reflect light and the angle of refraction obscures the printed wood grain. Real wood would absorb the light even when polished allowing the viewer to see the wood grain.



Engineered wood only has several pattern and sizes. The wood grain pattern will repeat and strip width and length are exactly the same size. Real wood floor has random grain and pattern and the grooves between planks is indented or "v" while engineered wood planks and laminate planks must fit tightly eliminating grooves to avoiding moisture seepage to the composite core. The particle core behaves like a sponge and will soak water quickly.
 
[quote author="bkshopr" date=1253927820]

Engineered wood only has several pattern and sizes. The wood grain pattern will repeat and strip width and length are exactly the same size. Real wood floor has random grain and pattern and the grooves between planks is indented or "v" while engineered wood planks and laminate planks must fit tightly eliminating grooves to avoiding moisture seepage to the composite core. The particle core behaves like a sponge and will soak water quickly.</blockquote>
I think you may be getting "engineered wood" mixed up with laminates like Pergo.



Engineered wood is real wood planks grafted onto other layers of plywood or MDF. So it looks like real wood on the surface (and can be refinished and restained) but has the advantages of the moisture protection (from the subfloor, not from spils) and ability to created clickable locking grooves like laminate.



There are many places in SoCal that you can't install real wood because of moisture issues... engineered wood gets around that.



Man... when did I become a Lumber Liquidators employee?
 
<a href="http://www.hoskinghardwood.com/Hardwood_Floors_7/7/Engineered_Wood_Floors.aspx">Engineered wood floor</a> is basically thin but real wood veneer glue to a manufactured plank that has the exact appearance of a real solid wood plank. My description earlier I tried to describe several items in the same text.



I will specifically write about this veneer product. In furniture we have seen real wood veneer attached to composite backing. The problem is where the pieces are being joined together and its structural integrity. Any dink to the edges and corner will expose the under-layers. All such by products rely on adhesive and hidden hardware. Real wood furniture often express its nut and bolt hardware.



Real wood floor has exposed nail heads and peg holes. The counter sinks are covered with a wood plug. Real wood planks also have knots and varied dramatic wood grain while Engineered wood has consistent tight and parallel grains due to their cut to maximization of harvest and required strength for handling a thin veneer. Veneer products avoid deep grooves because the product could not sustain angular force impact. One could not roll a 5,000 pound piano on 3 tiny coaster wheels across the engineered wood floor with deep grooves. Crushing force is bad for engineered wood planks.



Engineer plank is a cost effective way to achieve the real wood plank appearance. It will not wear and tear like a real wood plank. Its moisture barrier is from the bottom ideal for slab construction. It is just as vulnerable as real wood planks for topical spills.



Severely water damage on real planks could be dried, sanded and refinished but Engineered planks has limited restoration properties.
 
Pergo/laminate flooring is great to use for rentals because it saves you the cost of replacing or cleaning the carpet after every move-out. Besides, I know where to get decent looking laminate flooring for around $.75/sf.
 
[quote author="USCTrojanCPA" date=1253933051]Pergo/laminate flooring is great to use for rentals because it saves you the cost of replacing or cleaning the carpet after every move-out. Besides, I know where to get decent looking laminate flooring for around $.75/sf.</blockquote>


Absolutely if it is a rental. Pergo should go with condos. Only use real wood planks for the higher end homes and especially for a vintage. My wood floor was installed in 1934 and still look very good after 75 years.
 
[quote author="USCTrojanCPA" date=1253933051]Pergo/laminate flooring is great to use for rentals because it saves you the cost of replacing or cleaning the carpet after every move-out. Besides, I know where to get decent looking laminate flooring for around $.75/sf.</blockquote>
This depends. We had laminate flooring in our ex-rental and they ruined it with liquid spills (areas were noticeably bubbled up). When getting quotes to repair from at least 3 different sources, each one said that because of the fading and age of product, they couldn't just repair the area and had to redo the entire space which was costly.



Cleaning carpets and even replacing them is actually cheaper because you can do that on a room by room basis and it is the cheapest flooring material save maybe linoleum.



For upkeep and sturdiness... I think porecelain tile is a better choice than laminates.
 
[quote author="irvine_home_owner" date=1253936288][quote author="USCTrojanCPA" date=1253933051]Pergo/laminate flooring is great to use for rentals because it saves you the cost of replacing or cleaning the carpet after every move-out. Besides, I know where to get decent looking laminate flooring for around $.75/sf.</blockquote>
This depends. We had laminate flooring in our ex-rental and they ruined it with liquid spills (areas were noticeably bubbled up). When getting quotes to repair from at least 3 different sources, each one said that because of the fading and age of product, they couldn't just repair the area and had to redo the entire space which was costly.



Cleaning carpets and even replacing them is actually cheaper because you can do that on a room by room basis and it is the cheapest flooring material save maybe linoleum.



For upkeep and sturdiness... I think porecelain tile is a better choice than laminates.</blockquote>
Agreed, I would puts porcelain tiles in the kitchen, living room, hallways, bathrooms, etc while only doing laminate flooring in the bedrooms.
 
bkshopr,

These days, is hiring someone to construct an old-school shower from chicken wire and mud overkill and expensive?

Is it worth the expense over the typical Hardibacker/Wonderboard solution?
 
Bk - how does your floor hold up to the scratches of little dog paws? My friends who have hardwood floors and dogs say they are getting a lot of scratches and don't want the hassle of refinishing again so they're going to take it out and put in laminate because it's supposed to hold up better to the scratches. Maybe if you have hardwood it is less noticeable when the finish is not very dark. (Dark stains also show dirt and dust more quickly.)
 
[quote author="xoneinax" date=1254553066]bkshopr,

These days, is hiring someone to construct an old-school shower from chicken wire and mud overkill and expensive?

Is it worth the expense over the typical Hardibacker/Wonderboard solution?</blockquote>
I saw some faux stone shower overlay that looked decent at Lowe's... no hot-mopping necessary!
 
[quote author="xoneinax" date=1254553066]bkshopr,

These days, is hiring someone to construct an old-school shower from chicken wire and mud overkill and expensive?

Is it worth the expense over the typical Hardibacker/Wonderboard solution?</blockquote>


The old fashion method is to create a monolithic assembly to the shower. The idea is to eliminate any point load to the floor joists beneath the shower. Other newer system is not fastened into a integral monolithic assembly and the slight movement or flex will eventually lead to hairline crack and seepage of small amount of moisture into the floor or wall cavity causing mold.



Newer technology such as molded fiberglass and other high tech material can absorb flex and movement. The down side is that the idea was evolved from trailer homes.
 
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