More Republican lies about the Bridge to Nowhere!

NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
[quote author="green_cactus" date=1221023342]What I'm pointing out is that based on all the amendments that get slipped into a bill, you can make ANY senator to be in favor or against pretty much everything. It is disingenuous to hold this against Obama the same way it was incorrect for me to make those assumptions about McCain. It really is a petty argument to say that Obama was in favor of building the Bridge to Nowhere and claiming that Palin was the fiscal champion that fought tooth and nail to give this money back to the Dept. of Treasury because she didn't want it.</blockquote>


Apparently you have the same reading comprehension problems that Tim! has.



Both Obama and Biden voted for funding the Bridge to Nowhere twice.



The first time it was part of a large transportation package.



The second time that Obama and Biden voted for it, it was a bill (the Coburn amendment) that had one function - transfer funds away from the Bridge to Nowhere towards use in aiding Katrina victims.



They can't claim that it was an earmark they didn't support after voting for funding the second time.
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1221025091]Yes I can read, and I can also count.



And apparently you were only able to comprehend 8 words of 150 in my reply.



If you are willing to make the effort, I will find some adult remedial reading classes for you.</blockquote>


Look, you don't have to resort to insults unless you can't find a way to communicate. It doesn't make you look good when you do it, and you lose credibility. I'm not trying to misunderstand you. I truly don't see how else someone could read what you wrote. You specifically said she supported the bridge when she was running for Governor and you specifically said she canceled it when she was Governor. Since you can't (or won't) explain how you didn't say that, I have nothing else to go on.



If you want to be mean, maybe you can instead explain how you can count. What are those 8 words? I bolded 14 words, so you didn't count those. I used one word twice which makes 13 unique words, so you weren't counting unique bolded words either. What is this "8" that you counted? %-P
 
It's quite obvious that the only words you understood were "Sarah Palin supported the notorious Bridge to Nowhere"



It's also quite obvious that you lost context of the message of the post.



If you had understood it, you would realize the following basic facts



1) Sarah Palin voiced an opinion about a subject as a private citizen. As a private citizen, she had no ability to influence Federal spending. As governor of Alaska, she has no ability to introduce or vote for Federal spending bills.

2) Barrack Obama used the power of elective office to support an unnecessary project twice

3) Joe Biden used the power of elective office to support an unnecessary project twice

4) Both Barrack Obama and Joe Biden had the ability to use the power of elective office to vote against wasteful spending in an isolate manner. They decided to support this wasteful project even when it wasn't bundled in a larger bill.

5) Sarah Palin used the power of elective office to block the wasteful project that Barrack Obama and Joe Biden supported.

6) Barrack Obama and Joe Biden are hypocrites for trying to imply that Sarah Palin ran through a project that she blocked and that they helped pass.



Despite the nasty tone of your email, the offer to find adult remedial reading classes for you still stands. Once you take those classes, you *MIGHT* be able to move beyond picking random words from a paragraph and misunderstanding the intent of that paragraph.
 
Wow, could you be more condescending and arrogant?



I'll address your points:

1. As a private citizen, running for office, she supported the bridge. You said that was a fact. I am not contradicting you.

2. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

3. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

4. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

5. She blocked a project that she supported while running for election.

6. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.
 
[quote author="T!m" date=1221028792]Wow, could you be more condescending and arrogant?



I'll address your points:

1. As a private citizen, running for office, she supported the bridge. You said that was a fact. I am not contradicting you.

2. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

3. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

4. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

5. She blocked a project that she supported while running for election.

6. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.</blockquote>


Yes, I can always be more condescending and arrogant.



The more obtuse you are, the more condscending and arrogant I'll be.



If you were to talk intelligently about the subject at hand, I would react differently to you.



But you choose to do nothing but parrot lines from hypocrites.



Therefore I treated you as you deserve to be treated.
 
Dude, I quoted YOU. If that is parroting a hypocrite, then so be it.





[quote author="WINEX" date=1221030161][quote author="T!m" date=1221028792]Wow, could you be more condescending and arrogant?



I'll address your points:

1. As a private citizen, running for office, she supported the bridge. You said that was a fact. I am not contradicting you.

2. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

3. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

4. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.

5. She blocked a project that she supported while running for election.

6. I wasn't comparing Palin to Obama and/or Biden. I was talking about Palin alone.</blockquote>


Yes, I can always be more condescending and arrogant.



The more obtuse you are, the more condscending and arrogant I'll be.



If you were to talk intelligently about the subject at hand, I would react differently to you.



But you choose to do nothing but parrot lines from hypocrites.



Therefore I treated you as you deserve to be treated.</blockquote>
 
I was being condescending when I mentioned your lack of comprehension earlier. Now I believe it really may be the case. The offer to find adult reading courses for you still stands.
 
Voting on amendments is the quid-pro-quo that makes compromises work in Congress. S.Amdt 2165 passed with <strong>82%</strong> of votes. Once a passage pretty much is guaranteed a lot of votes will latch on. The reason being that such a vote can be used to call in a favor at some point. Fine - let's focus on actual amendments that get voted on. Of the ones that McCain even bothered to vote on we find out that he is:



- Against Teen Pregnancy Education S 403

- Against Hate Crimes Bill S 625

- Against Additional Funding For Veterans Amendment S 2020



and that's just a few
 
MAN...COME ON GUYS...there must be more dirt out there on this woman. The bridge to nowhere, library book banning, and per diem stuff are not going to do it. Bashing her on these issues will turn off voters from the democratic party...
 
[quote author="bugmenot" date=1221038387]MAN...COME ON GUYS...there must be more dirt out there on this woman. The bridge to nowhere, library book banning, and per diem stuff are not going to do it. Bashing her on these issues will turn off voters from the democratic party...</blockquote>


Bugmenot, look at where the polls are going. www.realclearpolitics.com is a great resource.
 
[quote author="bugmenot" date=1221038387]MAN...COME ON GUYS...there must be more dirt out there on this woman. The bridge to nowhere, library book banning, and per diem stuff are not going to do it. Bashing her on these issues will turn off voters from the democratic party...</blockquote>


Very true. I'll just wait until she opens her mouth in a live interview (not in a celebrity interview she is getting with Gibson). I guess I'll have to wait until the vice presidential debate.
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1221026447]It's quite obvious that the only words you understood were "Sarah Palin supported the notorious Bridge to Nowhere"



It's also quite obvious that you lost context of the message of the post.



If you had understood it, you would realize the following basic facts



1) Sarah Palin voiced an opinion about a subject as a private citizen. As a private citizen, she had no ability to influence Federal spending. As governor of Alaska, she has no ability to introduce or vote for Federal spending bills.

2) Barrack Obama used the power of elective office to support an unnecessary project twice

3) Joe Biden used the power of elective office to support an unnecessary project twice

4) Both Barrack Obama and Joe Biden had the ability to use the power of elective office to vote against wasteful spending in an isolate manner. They decided to support this wasteful project even when it wasn't bundled in a larger bill.

5) Sarah Palin used the power of elective office to block the wasteful project that Barrack Obama and Joe Biden supported.

6) Barrack Obama and Joe Biden are hypocrites for trying to imply that Sarah Palin ran through a project that she blocked and that they helped pass.



Despite the nasty tone of your email, the offer to find adult remedial reading classes for you still stands. Once you take those classes, you *MIGHT* be able to move beyond picking random words from a paragraph and misunderstanding the intent of that paragraph.</blockquote>




This is the reason why no Senator since JFK has won the presidential election...Deceptive people such as Winex can distort their voting record. You don't vote for a specific earmark. You vote on an entire bill, and the way things work in Washington, you have to either vote Yes or No on the entire bill. Every Senator adds his/her own little pet projects to each bill, and unfortunately, that's how the system works; you can't use line item veto. I find it funny how you had absolutely NO response (other than to change the subject to Iraq) to green_cactus when he called you out on your shameful tactic by using the same method to link McCain to a bunch of embarrassing earmarks. Keep in mind that Obama and Biden, along with a VAST majority of their colleagues, 93% to be exact, including 53 Republicans, voted Yes on this bill. But it's understood that in order to pass a bill, you allow some pet projects to be added to it. So just because Obama and Biden voted for the transportation bill, it doesn't mean they specifically voted for this Bridge to Nowhere earmark, as you, Winex, have deceptively portrayed it here.



Now, as far as your lame excuse for Palin supporting the Bridge to Nowhere as a ?private? citizen, she was running for Governor at the time she was supporting it! So basically, your argument is that it?s OK to run around the state, promising you will fight to get this money, and then after you get elected, you can reverse your previously held position once it becomes a national embarrassment?! Then you make the obnoxious, flat out FALSE claim that she ?used the power of elective office to block the wasteful project that Barrack Obama and Joe Biden supported?. Two lies here. First, Obama and Biden did not support this earmark. This was your Republican Senator, Ted Steven?s little pet project that was tacked on to a larger bill that Obama and Biden, along with 91 other Senators voted for. Second lie, Palin only terminated the earmark after the Congress had already killed it, and after it had become a national embarrassment. And she still kept the $300 million.



In addition, Mrs. Palin, sought and received the highest per capita earmark in the country while she was the mayor of Wasila. Now I don?t have a problem with that, you know, good for her, she?s trying to get as much as she can for her town. I don?t agree with the concept, but it?s one of those things where most politicians appear to practice, so I won?t chastise her for it. But if you?re going to do that, then don?t come out and criticize Obama for taking earmarks, especially given the fact that you hired a lobbyist firm in order to get these funds!



Now, as far as the Coburn Amendment is concerned, it appears to me that both Obama and Biden, along with 80 other senators, 38 of whom were Republicans, were following the unwritten rule in the Senate that says a freshman Senator, in this case Mr. Coburn, should not attempt to block funding for another Senator from another state. On top of that, the Republican Senator, Ted Stevens threw a big tantrum on the Senate floor and threatened to quit if the money was taken away from his state. I haven?t been able to find any material from Obama or Biden, or for that matter, from any of the 80 Senators who shut down this amendment as to why they voted against it. So I won?t make stuff up, like people on your side tend to do (i.e. Palin has foreign policy experience because Alaska?s right next door to Russia). What I do know is that again, majority of the Senate (82%) voted against it, including 38 Republicans. It wasn?t just Obama and Biden, as you are trying to make it appear. Personally, yes, I am disappointed that the amendment was shutdown. This however, does not change the fact that Sarah Palin is a LIAR when she claims she killed an earmark that had already been stopped by the Congress, an earmark that she had vigorously supported before it became unpopular, and the fact that she never returned the $300 million. Last time I checked, it wasn?t Obama running around the country shouting ?thanks, but no thanks? to the Bridge to Nowhere.



Unfortunately, these deceptive tactics that you employ do work, and that's the sad part of the whole political process in the U.S. Instead of having a civil discourse over the real issues that matter the most to us, we hear nothing but crap like guilt by association, distortion of voting records, and social wedge issues such as gay marriage or whether life begins at the point of conception or not. I don't think I'm going out on a limb here if I said your average voter is probably unaware of the fact that earmarks are part of a larger bill and that they're not voted on individually. So that's why extremists like you, Winex, thrive on spreading these discredited claims. You and your extremist right wing neo-con buddies know that if you just keep repeating the same falsehood over and over again, it will eventually influence a lot of people. That?s why at the time we invaded Iraq, well over 70% of Americans thought Saddam had something to do with 9/11, when in fact there was absolutely NO credible evidence linking him to those attacks.



We live in a culture of 30 second ads and sound bites, and sadly, it?s becoming more and more evident, election after election, that 30 seconds just about maxes outs most people?s attention span. That, or coming up with empty, meaningless slogans like ?they hate us for our freedom?, ?we have to be on offense?, or we?re good, they?re evil, we?re over here, they?re over there, etc, etc. That?s the reason why they make such effective use of many sports analogies, because to your average uninformed voter, they?re sitting there thinking, OK, yea, it?s kind of like football, you can?t play prevent defense, you have to be on the attack. It?s really, really sad that every time you have a candidate who instead of using a stupid sound bite like ?we must defeat evil?, gives you a detailed, well thought out logical reasoning that takes more than 30 seconds to explain, he is ridiculed, or is considered an ?elitist?! Why? Because he can?t explain a complex issue such as terrorism using football terminology in under 30 seconds?!



If you want to hammer Obama on real issues, such as his proposed tax plan, that's fine, that would be a legitimate argument, whether it's best to leave the tax code as is, or raise taxes on the wealthiest individuals, or what kind of impact raising the capital gains tax would have on the stock market. But don't bring up petty crap like the post where you used a ridiculous fear mongering tactic by saying that ?If Obama is elected, can we expect him to order the National Guard to surround the White House with tanks when it is time for him to step down from office?. Any reasonable person would view this statement as nothing but empty words coming from a biased, radical, hateful, and fear mongering hack. Even some of your own Republican peers on this board are tired of you and they are correct when they say you make Republicans look bad.
 
"Al", nice try, but it didn't work.



The truth is that both Obama and Biden had an opportunity to prevent the Bridge to Nowhere from being funded as an independent action. Obama is attempting to sell himself as a candidate representing "change" who is leaving traditional politics behind.



If that was the case, why would he follow any "unwritten rules" in the Senate. He obviously supported funding of a $300 million bridge that served a community of 50 people because he voted for it twice.



And why exactly would a candidate who is all about "change" care if a Senator who belonged to a different party threw a tantrum and threatened to quit? Given the fact that Ted Stevens was corrupt, there's even less reason for Obama or anyone to want to keep them around. (Unlike Obama, Sarah Palin took on corruption regardless of party affiliation. When you consider that Obama voted the party line 97% of the time, who is really the candidate who is all about change?)



And even if compelled to vote for funding the Bridge to Nowhere in isolation via the Coburn amendment by these unwritten rules that you speak of so that he could help preserve the career of a corrupt member of the opposition party, why was Obama compelled to make it sound like Palin supported the Bridge to Nowhere while neglecting to mention that he voted for it twice?



Face it buddy, you are way off base.
 
[quote author="WINEX" date=1221082271]"Al", nice try, but it didn't work.



The truth is that both Obama and Biden had an opportunity to prevent the Bridge to Nowhere from being funded as an independent action. Obama is attempting to sell himself as a candidate representing "change" who is leaving traditional politics behind.



If that was the case, why would he follow any "unwritten rules" in the Senate. He obviously supported funding of a $300 million bridge that served a community of 50 people because he voted for it twice.



And why exactly would a candidate who is all about "change" care if a Senator who belonged to a different party threw a tantrum and threatened to quit? Given the fact that Ted Stevens was corrupt, there's even less reason for Obama or anyone to want to keep them around. <strong>(Unlike Obama, Sarah Palin took on corruption regardless of party affiliation. When you consider that Obama voted the party line 97% of the time, who is really the candidate who is all about change?)</strong>



And even if compelled to vote for funding the Bridge to Nowhere in isolation via the Coburn amendment by these unwritten rules that you speak of so that he could help preserve the career of a corrupt member of the opposition party, why was Obama compelled to make it sound like Palin supported the Bridge to Nowhere while neglecting to mention that he voted for it twice?



Face it buddy, you are way off base.</blockquote>


You fling mud and divert with gossip when there are no concrete and legitimate reasons to argue.



That's the MO of the Liberals in general.



But if the opposition plays their game, they scream murder.
 
I am really bored of conversations that are along the lines of "liberals started it" "conservatives started it" "You acted like a jerk and used nonsensical arguments so I will act like a jerk and use nonsensical arguments".



Wrong is wrong, and fighting a lie with a lie makes me sick of both of you guys. I'm seriously thinking of writing in Coburn as a candidate as obviously no one in this country but him can find a way out of political sheninagins as usual. (And NO Palin is not a good example, and YES I did look at her story of standing up to the "Good Ole Boy" network and thus far it seems to me that she keeps convienently stepping out of the line of the firing squad once they have raised their guns and pointed it at the offending party).



But I am disappointed the most with my fellow Americans who seem incapable of sucking themselves out of party politicking. Are the average Americans being feted by lobbyists in order to influence their opinions? If not, why are they parroting their messages? The machines that preach hate for McCain and preach hate for Obama are ridiculous. Who hated these guys before they become the nominees? I don't recall anyone hating either of these guys (Ok, McCain did have a few enemies because of his temper. But he clearly wasn't considered a partisan hack, is my point). Now they are both the anti-christ?



You can be a good guy and still be wrong, and we can have a discussion on that level.



As is, both of them have clearly been playing the political game in order to get elected. The good news, is that it's at least clear to me that neither of them is on the moral bankruptcy level that the Bush campaign was. I see no Dick Cheney's on either staff. I see some Brownie's, which is a real problem, and what we should be discussing.



So my vote is back in play. I want to see some real arguments on why I should vote for either of these guys. Economy, healthcare, non-partisanship, and the ability to work with foreign partners to get stuff down overseas are my issues (like coordinating the CIA with groups in Britian and France in order to consolidate information on who is committing to terrorist acts).



You get 1 point per winning salient argument, and -1 point for red herrings, partisan attacks, character attacks, or the like. You get -2 points for lying, or using an incorrect example to make it look like your candidate did something right when they didn't (or when they were a bystander). And for the record, if you go to factcheck, you'll see both sides have been playing that game non stop since they were nominated.



You're clearly adults, start acting like adults. If a three year old kicks you in the shin, you don't kick him back.
 
Back
Top