Los Altos @ Stonegate East VS Santa Barbara @ Woodbury

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deega

New member
I was wondering if anyone on this forum is considering the Los Altos townhomes coming up in the Stonegate East. I have been looking to buy a new home in Irvine for quite some time now and I have been considering Santa Barbara in Woodbury as another option.

I am trying to do a comparison between Santa Barbara and Los Altos for quite some time now and haven't been able to make a decision. I know it all depends on what actually I want in a home.

I still wanted to open this thread so that I can get some valuable feedback that can help me take this decision.

Santa Barbara (SB) Plan 2 Vs Los Altos (LA) Plan 3

SB - Front entry & alley loaded garages (+) / LA - Front Door next to motorcourt garages (+/- ?)
SB - Woodbury Location - walk to Woodbury commons and shopping (+)  / LA - short drive to shopping (-)
SB -  Courtyard (-) / LA - Backyard (++)
SB -  Access to many pocket parks all over Woodbury (+) / LA - Access to a single park - Bluebird Park in Stonegate East (-)
SB -  Plan 2 downstairs bedroom with full bath downstairs - 3 bed 3 bath (+) / LA - All three Bedrooms upstairs - 3 bed 2.5 bath (-)
SB -  Street noise/Air Quality - Quiter Inner Streets (+) / LA -  Sandwiched between Sand Canyon and 133 Toll Road (-)
SB -  SQ Ft - 15xx (-) / LA - 16xx (+)
SB -  Parking - seems like on street parking would be a problem in Woodbury (-) / LA - Probably slightly better parking in Stonegate East (+/-?)
SB -  Builder Reputation - California Pacific (+/-?) / LA - Irvine Pacific (+/- ?)

We (me and my wife) are leaning towards Los Altos primarily because of the backyard, to get somewhat of a SFH feeling with private space. We recently had a tour of the Los Altos model homes that are being constructed right now and that really had a positive impact on us.

Thanks in advance.

 
For your last one... CalPac and IrvPac are basically the same thing. Both are tied to The Irvine Company.

After looking through your list, it seems like Santa Barbara has more pluses than minuses yet you are leaning towards Los Altos. In addition, based on the TIC sites, Los Altos Plan 3 is priced higher than Santa Barbara Plan 2.

I like the layout of the LA as it does seem more traditional with a front garage and backyard but I also like the downstairs bedroom of SB that gives you an additional downstairs flex space... but I'm sure the downstairs of LA felt bigger.

What other considerations make you like Los Altos more because the list favors Santa Barbara?

(and welcome to TI)
 
Thanks for the prompt response IHO.

I know, I know - its ironical that in my list I seem to favor SB more than LA.

To be frank the thought of having a private backyard - even though small (15  Ft deep x 25-30 Ft wide) is hard to ignore. My wife also likes LA a little more than SB for the reasons listed below:

- Backyard (my wife dismissed the courtyard of SB as dead space as she cant see herself using that space at all whereas however small may be the backyard fulfills our fantasy of a private open space that we do plan to use a lot)

- Great room of LA is bigger with kind of separate area for a small dining table as compared to a very long living room cum dining area in SB.

- In LA you don't enter directly into the living room/great room rather you enter a foyer that has high ceilings (Plan 3 of Los Altos)

- Extra windows in great room of LA looking out to the backyard - extra light in the living area really felt good while touring the model homes under construction

- Extra counter space and storage (In kitchen and Coat Closet)  in LA as compared to SB

- Wife didn't like the idea of the garage door opening into the kitchen in case of SB

- As per Vaastu Shashtra (East Indian equivalent of Feng Shui) the front door direction of Los Altos plan 3 (release 2) works best for us, icing on the cake is that in release 2 we will be getting the unit with desired front elevation out of the three options available (Note: Front door facing East / North / NE is considered good in Vaastu Shashtra - Science of Objects - literal translation)

Comparable units of Santa Barbara (Release 10)  and Los Altos (Release 2) that will be sold around the same time are going to have very little difference in price.

As per the info I have

SB - Plan 2 - Starting at 492K - desired corner unit - going somewhere around 519 K - 520 K based on older data for similar units in previous releases
LA - Plan 3 - Starting at 505K - desired corner unit - going to be somewhere around 520-525 K based on the estimates given by the office staff of Los Altos

We are willing to ignore a price difference of up to 15-20 K for the backyard option
 
The extra information helps.

As you know (and from a recent poll I posted), location is the biggest factor to many people and I like Woodbury vs. Stonegate East. I don't know if you have kids so that may matter less but if you do... it really favors WB.

But, other than the "location" rule... I think the other top one... and probably just as important... is the "wife" or "spouse" rule. Sounds like she's already made up her mind and if you absolutely have to buy now (I say that because I do think there may be better, cheaper options in the future, esp in the type of product you are looking at)... it looks like Los Altos has the lead. The only other thing I worry about is that the 'hood will look like when built out. You already know what WB will look like... and I would think that SGE would have the same street parking issues.

Have you considered Portola Springs? Or any other areas?
 
I think the SB plan 3 is really nice and its proximity to the town center and the commons can't be beat.  On the other hand, if the Los Altos is on a regular street, the curb appeal would be nicer and the SGE homes feed into Northwood High vs WB homes that feed into Irvine High, if that is a consideration.

I still think the attached products are way overpriced for what you get...
 
Thanks again IHO. I'm glad you could see the impact of wife/spouse rule and her satisfaction is quite important for me as well. Buying a home is her wish for a long time and she has been patiently waiting because I was not ready for the past 2 years to buy a home. As far as kids are concerned, we do have a 4 month old. We have been married for 3 years now and have been together for past 7 years and we have been saving for a home even before we got married.

I am sure it might not be the best time to buy one right now. I agree with the forecasters who predict that bottom (if any such thing exists)  is still a few months/ year(s) away.

I also firmly believe that like many other decisions that I have taken in life (some of them were not perfect as far as timing is concerned) we might be making a mistake in timing the market to buy a home.

But I am sure I wont regret it for two reasons, firstly; we do plan to stay in the home for a longer duration 8-10 yrs st the least (not assuming worst case scenario - both of us loosing jobs then we would have to move out). Secondly; I know that we have waited for a while, we are getting a starter home in the city we like a lot and satisfaction that you get by knowing that you have started making payments towards a home that one day you can call your own (ownership wise) is priceless.

I can live with the knowledge that I made a wrong decision from timing perspective but I also see a lot of value in the satisfaction and pride of ownership of a small place that you can call your own.

I also want to add that I am under no illusion that what I would own is not just a home but also a debt (a very big one for a very long time) :-)
 
Looks like you're 90% decided on LA but still want to give my 2cents.

If you have time, try to drop by the LA location at different time of the day and see if noise is a problem.
Noise is a problem in WBE (I've lived here for more than 1 year). I think Stonegate may have the same problem as it's part of the truck route.

Actually will you consider SB Plan 3? The loft upstairs is a ++. 3 master bedrooms is a ++. WB is a ++. Location in WB is a +++.

Otherwise LA's floorplan 3 is pretty good and it gives you a Single-family home feel. Best of luck.
 
deega,
It seems like you've done a lot of careful thinking about this and am aware of the possible decline in RE values if you buy now. But you're planning to be in the home for the long haul, and you're making this decision largely on the basis of providing a home for your family, so with interest rates this low, I'd say this is not a bad time to step in. It's the buyers of "starter homes" that worry me more. They're often the ones that believe prices have fully bottomed and expect a 20-30% return within five years so they can step up to an SFR.

Funny, I had been considering the same floor plans as you in SB and LA! I really like the SB plan 2 layout but the courtyard is a bit small. I agree the backyard you get in LA makes it a better choice. You'll miss out on the WB amenities but it looks like what you'll get in SGE shouldn't be too bad. My worry about LA in SGE is parking - there won't be room for parking on the same street as your residence -- you'll have to use the designated spaces or park along the street that cuts through the community (sorry don't remember the name).

After prequalifying in SB and LA and initially thinking I was going to purchase soon, I'm now 85-90% leaning toward sitting out the market for a while, until the glut of REOs and other irregularities work their way through the system and we know better how that might affect the RE market. I don't have kids so I guess buying is not an urgency right now.
 
Stonegate East, like Woodbury East, is right next to the freeway.  You will hear traffic 24/7.
 
iphb said:
My worry about LA in SGE is parking - there won't be room for parking on the same street as your residence -- you'll have to use the designated spaces or park along the street that cuts through the community (sorry don't remember the name).
Click to expand...

The residences will be on normal streets, not motorcourts, so residents will be alllowed to park in front of their homes.
 
hidden said:
Looks like you're 90% decided on LA but still want to give my 2cents.

If you have time, try to drop by the LA location at different time of the day and see if noise is a problem.
Noise is a problem in WBE (I've lived here for more than 1 year). I think Stonegate may have the same problem as it's part of the truck route.

Actually will you consider SB Plan 3? The loft upstairs is a ++. 3 master bedrooms is a ++. WB is a ++. Location in WB is a +++.

Otherwise LA's floorplan 3 is pretty good and it gives you a Single-family home feel. Best of luck.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your time hidden. Its interesting that you mention that, I have been to the location(s) SB and LA multiple times at different times of the day and not just drove past it but stopped close to the entrance and switched off my car to get a real feeling of traffic. I do understand that traffic is only going to increase after the homes are occupied and Stonegate area is developed along with remaining part of PS.

I am only concerned about air quality to be frank, because most of my life I have stayed in a big crowded city in India (New Delhi - national capital) I know it might not sound right to all - but traffic noise doesn't seem to bother me much. When my parents visit us time to time, they really feel the 'quiet' here... to an extent that it's a little odd for them.

To answer your second question, we are ignoring everything outside our range of 480K - 530K. When we started looking earlier we realized that its very easy to be sucked into a situation when you are looking for a 480K home and for additional 20K you get an additional bedroom and stuff like that. So we are trying to stick to our budget even though we can be approved for a loan much higher. We tried very hard to not be tempted by additional features that you find in a little bigger homes and we have finalized that we are not going to go over our limit of 530K.

So that's the reason we are not considering Plan 3 of SB even though we really liked the loft space - upper living area/ Thanks again.
 
iphb said:
deega,
It seems like you've done a lot of careful thinking about this and am aware of the possible decline in RE values if you buy now. But you're planning to be in the home for the long haul, and you're making this decision largely on the basis of providing a home for your family, so with interest rates this low, I'd say this is not a bad time to step in. It's the buyers of "starter homes" that worry me more. They're often the ones that believe prices have fully bottomed and expect a 20-30% return within five years so they can step up to an SFR.

Funny, I had been considering the same floor plans as you in SB and LA! I really like the SB plan 2 layout but the courtyard is a bit small. I agree the backyard you get in LA makes it a better choice. You'll miss out on the WB amenities but it looks like what you'll get in SGE shouldn't be too bad. My worry about LA in SGE is parking - there won't be room for parking on the same street as your residence -- you'll have to use the designated spaces or park along the street that cuts through the community (sorry don't remember the name).

After prequalifying in SB and LA and initially thinking I was going to purchase soon, I'm now 85-90% leaning toward sitting out the market for a while, until the glut of REOs and other irregularities work their way through the system and we know better how that might affect the RE market. I don't have kids so I guess buying is not an urgency right now.
Click to expand...

IPHB,

I understand your concerns with home buyers and expectations. I am sure there are people out there, who have done much more research and spent lot more time in analyzing the market and reading and processing data that supports the decision to sit out for a while and not buy right now. 

The only downside that I can see for us is that a few months or year(s) down the lane if we decide to wait out we will be able to afford a slightly bigger better home for the same amount that we are spending now.

We are a very young family and for the foreseeable future the space that we are getting with LA is good enough for us. It might sound irrational to a lot of smarter people out there but I do believe in taking some decisions by following my heart as well. Buying a home now while the interest rates are at historical lows and we are able to afford the kind of home we wanted (we couldn't have afforded something similar at the peak) we decided to go ahead.

This will be a positive change for my family, like everyone else - my wife and I work hard for our jobs and I believe when you end up doing things that you really want to do - it gives you a shot of energy and satisfaction - nothing compares to that. So instead of waiting now and trying to time the market, we have decided to give in to the temptation.

I have done some basic calculations and have already come up with scenarios where I stand to loose some money if things don't go as per the plan (us loosing jobs etc etc). I do understand the risk and we are prepared to face that situation and it wont be the end of world for us. I am expecting zero appreciation and in fact some depreciation on these properties for the first 5 years.
 
ajw522 said:
iphb said:
My worry about LA in SGE is parking - there won't be room for parking on the same street as your residence -- you'll have to use the designated spaces or park along the street that cuts through the community (sorry don't remember the name).
Click to expand...

The residences will be on normal streets, not motorcourts, so residents will be alllowed to park in front of their homes.
Click to expand...

They'll probably be able to park on the driveway, but not on their own streets. The mockup of the neighborhood at the sales office showed that the driveways will be close together to not allow for curbside parking. There will be spots available at the end of each street and I think the mainline road that cuts through the neighborhood has open parking.
 
Woodbury East and StoneGate East remind me of West Irvine (stuck between Jamboree and Tollroad).  West Irvine plays second fiddle to not only rest of Irvine, but to Tustin Ranch also.
 
Jumpcut,

I rented for a year at Woodbury Square Apartment homes and I do value the Woodbury amenities a lot. I know SE doesn't hold up when compared to WB when you are comparing just the amenities and hence the dilemma.

From what I have seen I believe the look and feel of the home that you will be approaching every day is slightly better for Los Altos as compared to Santa Barbara in my books. I know there are so many pros and cons with each one.

You wont believe that I came up with a decision making system (lol) :-) and identified all the possible differences between Los Altos and Santa Barbara and rated everything on a scale of 1 -5. (1 - I don't care, 2 - Can see some value in it, 3 - Good to have, 4 - Very high on priority list & 5 - Really want it).

Guess what my score came out 38/36 in favor of Santa Barbara while my wife favored Los Altos 41\38 in comparison to Santa Barbara . We are cutting so close that's the reason I am looking for feedback from you all. Thanks for your time.

It must be obvious that my wife favors whats inside the walls more than whats outside and me vise-versa. I think these are the challenges that first time home buyers face because they do have an idea of what they want in their first home but they are not sure what do they REALLY want and what they can live without.
 
Not sure if this is important to you, but having dealt with noisy neighbors in the past, I always ask to see how the units are actually attached to each other.  I was considering SB3 and the agents were kind enough to take me out to some of the units that were being built before the dry wall went up.  You can actually see how much spacing you have, as well as exactly how much overlap you will have.  For plan 3, the wall that runs behind the laundry room and one of the bedrooms is the wall of the kitchen and part of the living room of a plan 1. 
 
deega,

You are welcome!

From your comments, I can see that you are very logical and well prepared on your home selection. I know you also have the wife factor too.  :)

For your decision engine, maybe you can add another level of factoring like Health benefits (less noisy,cleaner air: x 1.2) & Luxury only (bigger space, bigger yard: x 0.8 ) if health is more than luxury in your life.

I understand that noise is not a problem for you. However, you may want to rethink it again for your kid and future kids. I never thought that road noise could be a problem since I thought there shouldn't be too many cars at night. Well, until I lived in an apartment close to Sand Canyon. You will hear noise from trucks or other sports cars at any time, either late night or even early morning. It's loud enough that can wake you up.

Location within Irvine is also very important as somebody has already mentioned. I think we just want you to consider different factors before making one of the biggest decisions in your life.

All the best!
 
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