For my own peace of mind Ive decided to drink the IHB kool aid. Y?all win.

NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
[quote author="muffdaddy" date=1225933263]<a href="http://www.ocregister.com/articles/local-results-orange-2208971-county-election">http://www.ocregister.com/articles/local-results-orange-2208971-county-election</a>



I'm surprised. As an Obama supporter living in Irvine, I thought I was in the minority. 57.7% Obama, 40.49% McCain?



Only two cities in Orange County broke harder for Obama: Santa Ana and Laguna Beach(?). Who knew that Irvine was such a bastion of socialists ;-)? It's those dadgum immig'ants I's tells you.</blockquote>




Capitalistic merchants are pigs who profit at the expense and ignorance of the proletariat consumers. Only under a dictatorship of the proletariat workers can we establish a worker's state, toward a revolutionary, classless communist society.



Oh wait, communism was SO last season. And I can't seem to find proletariat factory assembly line workers in Irvine. Just the other day, I had to drive all the way to Costa Mesa to recruit some teenagers working in the back of an Edible Arrangements. They were from wealthy Newport Beach families and worked on the assembly line in the back making chocolate dipped fruits. Close enough I say! Truly terrible working condition for their class, and being forced to taste-test their the products daily! Perhaps they'd be interested in a copy of The Communist Manifesto?



<img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/85/Marx-Engels-Forum01.jpg" alt="" />



Yuppie proletarians of all wealthy enclaves of the world unite! Or whatever...
 
nancy, if you have to cut jobs it's the fault of a potential 4% marginal tax increase today, yeah? not possibly because of oh... i don't know, maybe the entire economy, esp real estate and construction, being in the tank? quite honestly you really jumped the shark when you told blackvault to go EFF himself and lashed out with the tired ol' "can't even afford a house" insult to the general group. that's the IHB equivalent of when my niece doesn't have a good comeback and says, "oh yeah, well you're uh.... uh... a stupidface!"



i'm really bummed to see this because i'm in the same camp. i don't want to pay any more taxes than i have to so 90% of the time i will vote for the guy that serves my best interests. in this case we lost. it was a fair fight and the other side won. so be it... but lets be honest here. if i have to pay 4% more on the portion of my AGI over a quarter million bucks, i'll survive. you will too. and at this point its better to focus your attention on what's going to happen with that money and how its going to be spent so the policy has the best chance of succeeding. if not, next time we fight harder.
 
For many last night was a bitter defeat.

For others it is the dawn of a new era in American Politics.

I think we should all give Obama a chance to do the job we as

Americans have elected him for. After the last 8 Years of "Whats his Name"

we sure should look forward to a huge improvment in our attitudes about

our new POTUS. No he is not the second coming of Jesus. But he is a young man

that has made it on his own to the highest office in the land.

Congratulations President Elect Obama.



Wow cant believe Irvine was so liberal.

I was one of the few Anglo`s at my pollng station.

Guess all those people with names NOBODY could pronounce are libs.
 
[quote author="skek" date=1225937871]The Obama tax increase has two portions -- First, he is proposing to raise the top marginal rate by about 4% on incomes over $250k. Second, and this is why business owners like Nancy have a right to be upset, he is also proposing levying the social security tax against high incomes. The amount of the tax varies, but in some of his statements, he has proposed charging the entire tax -- 12.4% (6.2% on the employee side, 6.2% on the employer side, the full thing if you are self-employed) on incomes above $250k. The lowest number I've seen is 4%-ish, and there's been talk about phasing it in. But, when you consider the potential increase in taxes with no corresponding benefits, the true scope of the Obama tax increase at the top bracket is somewhere between 7.6% and 16%. Add to that the inevitable California tax increases, and I can see why business owners are worried. And once again, this is why -- as I pointed out in the Tax Calculator thread -- Democrats don't use real world examples to show why their tax increases are fair. The fact is, they DO cost jobs. It's much easier and politically more expedient to use hedge fund managers and billionaires as poster-boys for a "soak the rich" tax policy.



By the way, those who pay the new social security taxes won't get any increased benefits - in fact, Obama may means test them and take their social security benefits away. So not only is this a tax hike, it would also be a major change in the philosophy underpinning social security which was always intended to be a forced savings trust fund, NOT a welfare program.</blockquote>


I believe they already do the mean test for medicare. As far as SS, from what I read, you can only suppose to have income up to $32K per year, otherwise you will be taxed 85% of you SS.
 
I'm not worried about Obama that much. I'm more worried about the Congress being Democratic. They will try (like the last presidency) to shove all sorts of stuff down our throats. Doing so when this country isn't in the best shape. After all this FAR out of control spending (which the Republicans aren't supposed to be for), didn't anybody think we would actually have to tighten our belts?



With Clinton I paid taxes, with GWB, I paid taxes. I have no illusions that whatever person we elected we will HAVE TO pay more.



I understand alot of the feelings, I've watched 25% of my IRA/401k dissappear. I've watched my apartment income stream steadily go lower, I've watched my equity in all the real estate go lower. I don't think there is any good way to really pull out of this other than band together, save, pay off our bills and WORK (whomever may be president - at least that is my hope....).



Anyways good luck

-bix
 
NO_Vas



You are sooooo wrong. You have to be a NASCAR fan first. Everything else will line up.



In the words of that great American, "Can't we just all get along-neck"



I can't get back to being an Indy Car fan until P.T. has a ride and Duno doesn't.



Enjoy!
 
[quote author="skek" date=1225937871]The Obama tax increase has two portions -- First, he is proposing to raise the top marginal rate by about 4% on incomes over $250k. Second, and this is why business owners like Nancy have a right to be upset, he is also proposing levying the social security tax against high incomes</blockquote>


Do do know I am a business owner and self employed, yes?



<blockquote>Democrats don't use real world examples to show why their tax increases are fair. The fact is, they DO cost jobs. It's much easier and politically more expedient to use hedge fund managers and billionaires as poster-boys for a "soak the rich" tax policy.</blockquote>


Bullshit. Taxes for the self employed business owner (like Nancy and myself) are driven from profits. No profits? No taxes!



Show me one real world example on how a higher tax rate is going to dissuade me from hiring somebody. (I can think of one. It involves a flat tax situation).



<blockquote>By the way, those who pay the new social security taxes won't get any increased benefits - in fact, Obama may means test them and take their social security benefits away. So not only is this a tax hike, it would also be a major change in the philosophy underpinning social security which was always intended to be a forced savings trust fund, NOT a welfare program. </blockquote>


And a Republican would of done differently exactly what? Somebody is going to have to carve up that shit sandwich sooner or later and feed it to the public. Medicare, SSI, are all ticking time bombs.
 
[quote author="skek" date=1225938359]

What a wonderful country we live in where someone of Obama's background* can rise to become President of the greatest nation on earth! God bless America!

</blockquote>


on the contrary, this nation is still incredibly racist. we just stuck a black man with the nation's worst job.



<a href="http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/black_man_given_nations">http://www.theonion.com/content/news_briefs/black_man_given_nations</a>
 
May I humbly suggest that if you are starting a thread that is political or may be political because the folks being discussed are politicians, could you start your thread in the "Politics" section? Gracias.
 
I am not sure what you expected from this thread. Were you hoping for uniform agreement with all of your ideas and concerns? It is one thing to express your views and ideas. We all do that here. It is another to insist that everyone agree with you. It is a path that will not lead to happiness or peace of mind.
 
Skek, first I'd like to say that although I disagree with your views some times, I also very much admire the way you present your points. I work for a New Zealand software company who is not incorporated in the US. While I have vacation time and am considered an employee to them, they do not report my wages or take taxes out, so my taxes are done via a schedule C. Although I do have to pay all of my self employment tax, I've found that I'm still in a better position than if I was a wage earner. There are a lot more deductions that I can take on the schedule C that I wasn't able to get when I was a W2 employee.



And when I was an employee, I didn't see any difference in my taxes under the Bush tax cuts. In fact, I had gone back to school during the last downturn that forced the state system to raised tuition. The hikes in tuition were far greater than any tax cut that I got. I really felt like I was getting much less for my tax dollars.
 
To be honest, even if it costs me more, I long for the days when I was W-2, we didn't itemize or have property. I know that it shouldn't be this hard to figure out how much we owe the government. My company is in the process of incorporating and I'm really looking forward to not having that Schedule C in Apirl '10. I'm really glad that the brokerages have to start including the cost basis for stocks too. My schedule D was an absolute nightmare last year as I liquidated everything, including big losers I had bought in 2000 and had switched brokerages. It's absolutely ridiculous how convulated it is and the different intepretations of what each piece of the code really means.
 
[quote author="skek" date=1225961587][quote author="stepping_up" date=1225960193]Skek, first I'd like to say that although I disagree with your views some times, I also very much admire the way you present your points.</blockquote>


Thanks, stepping_up. In this heated political climate, that means a lot.



Also, thanks for your thoughts on taxes. Although I'm not a tax expert, I agree that the self-employed have access to more deductions to reduce their tax burden. Others are able to run quasi-personal expenses through their business and extract less taxable income as a result. The tax code is nothing if not a full employment act for lawyers and accountants.</blockquote>


You're welcome. Thank you for being an excellent role model. Because I respect you, everything you say actually carries more weight and I really think about your points. You and several other conservatives have really made a difference in how I see the true members republican party and I understand why you believe what you do.



I was pretty PO'd this morning and allowed myself to sink to a low level. The views of this one person bothered me, but how they went about expressing it just outraged me and I lost my cool. I feel like crap for stooping to that level, but at the same time I can't deny that I actually meant what I said. How exactly do you keep yourself from allowing your emotions to get the better of you?
 
[quote author="stepping_up" date=1225966463]How exactly do you keep yourself from allowing your emotions to get the better of you?</blockquote>


Skek's job as a high school football side judge has many ancillary social benefits; chief among them the ability to stay the course.



<object width="325" height="250"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/youtube" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="325" height="250"></embed></object>



<em>Edited to add: I only wish this guy's jersey number was 909.</em>
 
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