effenheimer_IHB
New member
Yen in the 112's tonight? Only 16bp to go.
Bridges collapsing, earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunamis, the stock market...
- Thread starter Masterofdamoney_IHB
- Start date
NEW -> Contingent Buyer Assistance Program
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
Good times. Not.
effenheimer_IHB
New member
Yup. 112.95. This has got to be forcing hedge funds to unwind perfectly good positions. Tomorrow should be another interesting day.
bishie_IHB
New member
That bill is really damaging to Hispanics who are genuinely making money under the table and use check cashers to pay their bills. I do know some Hispanics that genuinely make $30+/hr all in cash so they can afford the mortgage payment on their home but none of it shows up in bank records or paystubs. It is my strong feeling that the market should bear the risk of proving that Julio can make payments without any reported income. Even if there is a 150 bp spread for stated there are people for whom such products are the correct loan.
The market not the government should be making the call as to how to price this risk. Personally I see nothing wrong with LIBOR rising 60bp overnight. If you have an ARM that happened to step up on that day that was a risk you took signing up for that instrument. I also see nothing wrong with 8% at 20% down for jumbos. If lenders desire 130 bp spread for jumbo so be it. If that is too much spread some bank or hedge fund will step up to the plate and start lending at 7.8% and get substantial deal flow.
Disclaimer: I am not in the loan business but am strongly affected by changes in the RE/lending market.
The market not the government should be making the call as to how to price this risk. Personally I see nothing wrong with LIBOR rising 60bp overnight. If you have an ARM that happened to step up on that day that was a risk you took signing up for that instrument. I also see nothing wrong with 8% at 20% down for jumbos. If lenders desire 130 bp spread for jumbo so be it. If that is too much spread some bank or hedge fund will step up to the plate and start lending at 7.8% and get substantial deal flow.
Disclaimer: I am not in the loan business but am strongly affected by changes in the RE/lending market.
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
<em>>>Even if there is a 150 bp spread for stated there are people for whom such products are the correct loan.</em>
Including people guilty of income tax evasion like your example Julio? Uh, no. I don't think so.
Including people guilty of income tax evasion like your example Julio? Uh, no. I don't think so.
bishie_IHB
New member
EvalSeraphim: The key difference is one of citizenship status between a Hispanic person who pays the check cashing fee to avoid bank records and a white person who is at least equally guilty of tax evasion for running a restaurant that loses money each year for income tax purposes but maintains bank records. This is why Hispanics a) have cash on them or under their mattress and b) why Hispanics tend to be targets for robbery. Hispanics and Asians both often have more than 2 wage earners living in a house. Are lenders really willing to look at financials of all 12 countertop installers genuinely living in that house in the IE (several of whom are probably illegal and hence working under the table / using false security numbers)? There are two issues in this example: a) not all 12 are likely on title and b) tax evasion may not genuinely be a choice for many of these individuals.
Do Hispanic interest groups (who lean primarily Democratic) want many of their members to be effectively barred from buying homes going forward? To my mind this is a bill that heavily benefits investors cum slum lords that will in turn lease to Hispanics who have no chance of buying the homes they live in. Depreciation on houses that are owner occupied tends to be lower than those that are renter occupied so we can expect less "pride of ownership" and hence higher depreciation in many communities. Since ownership is tax advantaged through the mortgage interest deduction this is effectively a transfer from Hispanics to whites like Social Security.
No I am not Hispanic and no I am not a proponent of illegal immigration. Just I think you need to think carefully about the ramifications of this type of legislation.
Do Hispanic interest groups (who lean primarily Democratic) want many of their members to be effectively barred from buying homes going forward? To my mind this is a bill that heavily benefits investors cum slum lords that will in turn lease to Hispanics who have no chance of buying the homes they live in. Depreciation on houses that are owner occupied tends to be lower than those that are renter occupied so we can expect less "pride of ownership" and hence higher depreciation in many communities. Since ownership is tax advantaged through the mortgage interest deduction this is effectively a transfer from Hispanics to whites like Social Security.
No I am not Hispanic and no I am not a proponent of illegal immigration. Just I think you need to think carefully about the ramifications of this type of legislation.
effenheimer_IHB
New member
<p>NIKKEI:</p>
<p><img alt="" src="http://www.nikkei.co.jp/gifdata/nk_chart_L.gif" /></p>
<p></p>
<p><img alt="" src="http://www.nikkei.co.jp/gifdata/nk_chart_L.gif" /></p>
<p></p>
effenheimer_IHB
New member
<p>Today's Pepsi-out-the-nose comment from CR:</p>
<em>"My experience here has taught me that the bears wouldn't care if Jesus himself was making the bullish case, with Moses flipping the charts for him."</em>
<em>"My experience here has taught me that the bears wouldn't care if Jesus himself was making the bullish case, with Moses flipping the charts for him."</em>
effenheimer_IHB
New member
<p>From Minyanville:</p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://www.minyanville.com/articles/Canada-GS-BSC-LEH-SLM/index/a/13699"><img alt="" src="http://www.smugmug.com/photos/185180344-L.jpg" /></a></p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://www.minyanville.com/articles/Canada-GS-BSC-LEH-SLM/index/a/13699"><img alt="" src="http://www.smugmug.com/photos/185180344-L.jpg" /></a></p>
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
Bishie -
Just because someone is undocumented doesn't mean they can't file tax returns. In fact, for the past two years around tax time, there have been news stories about how undocumented immigrants do file tax returns. Per the IRC, the information in tax returns is privileged and confidential.
But for more info on that issue, go <a href="http://immigration.about.com/od/uslegaltroubles/tp/UndocsFileTaxes.htm">here</a>, <a href="http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/4/16/170927.shtml?s=lh">here</a>, <a href="http://iblsjournal.typepad.com/illinois_business_law_soc/2007/04/undocumented_ta.html">here</a>, and <a href="http://www.nydailynews.com/boroughs/2007/03/08/2007-03-08_income_taxes_and_the_itin_.html">here</a>, for examples.
Seriously, just Google "undocumented 'tax returns'" and you will find a wealth of information.
<em>>>Are lenders really willing to look at financials of all 12 countertop installers genuinely living in that house in the IE (several of whom are probably illegal and hence working under the table / using false security numbers)? </em>
Actually, those lenders are dying to have those folks as clients. Check out B of A.
<em>
>>There are . . . issues in this example: a) not all 12 are likely on title</em>
And the ones that are better be trustworthy. There is nothing less fun than a title fight over who are the equitable vs. legal owners of the property. You want a scam that will hurt Hispanics (or, really, anyone else)? One that involves someone with "legal" status ostensibly "investing" the wages of those that aren't and then booting the undocumented persons out of the property. "They gave me money because they were just renting," the person on title tells the judge.
<em>
>> Since ownership is tax advantaged through the mortgage interest deduction this is effectively a transfer from Hispanics to whites like Social Security.</em>
Yes, the tax code is a reverse Robin Hood and which is based on race, not income. Not. I take it that you are unaware of the Earned Income Tax Credit? I have to say, I was completely unaware that only Hispanics paid into Social Security and that white folk were the only recipients. I know I've been less than careful in my phrasing at times, so I'll assume that that was the case with your comment here.
Just because someone is undocumented doesn't mean they can't file tax returns. In fact, for the past two years around tax time, there have been news stories about how undocumented immigrants do file tax returns. Per the IRC, the information in tax returns is privileged and confidential.
But for more info on that issue, go <a href="http://immigration.about.com/od/uslegaltroubles/tp/UndocsFileTaxes.htm">here</a>, <a href="http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/4/16/170927.shtml?s=lh">here</a>, <a href="http://iblsjournal.typepad.com/illinois_business_law_soc/2007/04/undocumented_ta.html">here</a>, and <a href="http://www.nydailynews.com/boroughs/2007/03/08/2007-03-08_income_taxes_and_the_itin_.html">here</a>, for examples.
Seriously, just Google "undocumented 'tax returns'" and you will find a wealth of information.
<em>>>Are lenders really willing to look at financials of all 12 countertop installers genuinely living in that house in the IE (several of whom are probably illegal and hence working under the table / using false security numbers)? </em>
Actually, those lenders are dying to have those folks as clients. Check out B of A.
<em>
>>There are . . . issues in this example: a) not all 12 are likely on title</em>
And the ones that are better be trustworthy. There is nothing less fun than a title fight over who are the equitable vs. legal owners of the property. You want a scam that will hurt Hispanics (or, really, anyone else)? One that involves someone with "legal" status ostensibly "investing" the wages of those that aren't and then booting the undocumented persons out of the property. "They gave me money because they were just renting," the person on title tells the judge.
<em>
>> Since ownership is tax advantaged through the mortgage interest deduction this is effectively a transfer from Hispanics to whites like Social Security.</em>
Yes, the tax code is a reverse Robin Hood and which is based on race, not income. Not. I take it that you are unaware of the Earned Income Tax Credit? I have to say, I was completely unaware that only Hispanics paid into Social Security and that white folk were the only recipients. I know I've been less than careful in my phrasing at times, so I'll assume that that was the case with your comment here.