Anyone have any suggestions for a water softener and reverse osmosis?

[hurijo]

From what I understand, the thing conditioners do that softeners don't do is remove some chemicals, namely chlorine, chloramines, and lead. RO should remove those things for drinking water, but whether you're concerned about those things like during bath/shower is why you would get both.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

I heard the contrary that you do want chlorine inside your pipes and only install RO and chlorine at the end points.

From what I understand, the thing conditioners do that softeners don't do is remove some chemicals, namely chlorine, chloramines, and lead. RO should remove those things for drinking water, but whether you're concerned about those things like during bath/shower is why you would get both.

 

[CalBears96]

I heard the contrary that you do want chlorine inside your pipes and only install RO and chlorine at the end points.

From what I understand, the thing conditioners do that softeners don't do is remove some chemicals, namely chlorine, chloramines, and lead. RO should remove those things for drinking water, but whether you're concerned about those things like during bath/shower is why you would get both.

Considering chlorine is used to eliminate slime bacteria, molds, and algae in water pipes, I would say what you heard is correct.

"Shock chlorinating water lines is one of the most popular methods for sanitizing pipelines. Chlorine?s powerful germicidal action eliminates slime bacteria, molds, and algae in water pipes."

 

[box]

I was told by Falsken that if you have both the conditioner and the water softener, the water conditioner goes BEFORE the water softener.

And by having the water conditioner in place, it actually extends the life of the water softener.

 

[CalBears96]

I was told by Falsken that if you have both the conditioner and the water softener, the water conditioner goes BEFORE the water softener.

And by having the water conditioner in place, it actually extends the life of the water softener.

I think it's true that it would extend the life of the water softener since chlorine causes corrosion. And it's probably also better for your skin when you shower. The only thing I'm not sure about it Falsken's claim is about the water conditioner:

Inhibits the Growth of Bacteria, Fungi, Algae and Mold

Are they saying that after going through the water conditioner, the water is so clean that when it flows through the pipes, it prevents bacteria, fungi, algae and mold from growing?

 

[akkord]

From what I understand, the thing conditioners do that softeners don't do is remove some chemicals, namely chlorine, chloramines, and lead. RO should remove those things for drinking water, but whether you're concerned about those things like during bath/shower is why you would get both.

Conditioners - from what I know worthless, but supposed to do what a whole house carbon filter does
Whole House Carbon Filter - removes chemicals, smells, etc
Softener -  calcium and magnesium and exchange them for sodium or potassium

I have my softener --> whole house carbon --> House which also has an RO (I drink a lot of water 3/4 to 1 gallon a day)

Whole House Carbon filter 5-8 years depending if you have a backwash system IIRC
Resin in the softener needs to be replaced about 7-9 years depending on usage

The softeners supposedly help with the tankless too, less flushing with vinegar which is true.  First year I had the house, I didn't have anything, did a flush and it was greenish, I did a flush a year after I installed the tankless and it was pretty clear, I'm going to do another flush in about a month which would be a year and a half since the last one, will report back if remember to. 

 

[akkord]

Irvine Pacific is currently using Falsken Water System products for whole house water conditioner, water softener, and undersink RO system.
https://falskenwatersystems.com/

Anyone have experience with them?

I have the Falsken Water Conditioner and Softener. It seems like it works fine - haven't had any issues. I should test my water soon. I do notice that there isn't as much pink/mildew in our showers and sinks with a conditioner and softener.

Why do you need a conditioner and a softener, I've always read conditioners don't do anything, just use a softener, wondering why you have both.

According to the Falsken website, the conditioner is more for the taste. It has nothing to do with softening the water. But if you get a RO, do you still need the conditioner?

I bought my house from the original owner. They opted for the water conditioner from Irvine Pacific. When we moved into the house we found that the conditioner was OK but we needed the softener for the water spots. The water goes through the conditioner and the softener before coming into the house. The water people suggested it's very close to drinking water. I have yet to test it myself though.

Makes sense, I've always said to go pass on conditioners and go carbon, but that's just me.

 

[akkord]

I heard the contrary that you do want chlorine inside your pipes and only install RO and chlorine at the end points.

From what I understand, the thing conditioners do that softeners don't do is remove some chemicals, namely chlorine, chloramines, and lead. RO should remove those things for drinking water, but whether you're concerned about those things like during bath/shower is why you would get both.

I've heard of this too, I have no idea if it's right or not, I've seen arguments for both, but I think of it as the water coming into my house is chloromined up by IRWD, it flows through my softener and carbon filter, and we use the water regularly throughout the house so it's not really sitting in the pipes for very long for bacteria/mold. 

 

[potsticker]

My guess is the conditioner is a "salt-free" treatment option for Irvine Pacific buyers because it's more favorable in the eyes of IRWD. They have a whole section on their site about how bad salt softeners are:https://www.irwd.com/save-water-money/residential-water-treatment-devices

At any rate, if I had a choice, I would've just gone with the softener. But, I'm not going to uninstall the conditioner...might as well have some double-barrel action going.

 

[CalBears96]

My guess is the conditioner is a "salt-free" treatment option for Irvine Pacific buyers because it's more favorable in the eyes of IRWD. They have a whole section on their site about how bad salt softeners are:https://www.irwd.com/save-water-money/residential-water-treatment-devices

At any rate, if I had a choice, I would've just gone with the softener. But, I'm not going to uninstall the conditioner...might as well have some double-barrel action going.

There is a problem with your guess, though. The conditioner does not soften water.

This is from Falsken's website:

The Real Truth About Water Conditioners

• These units do not produce soft water. If you test the water hardness entering the unit and the water hardness leaving the unit, there will be no reduction in the hardness.
• These units should never be sold as a solution for hard water issues.

What Can I Expect From A Water Conditioner

• Better Tasting Water Throughout the House
• Reduces the Chlorine and Chloramine Content for Showering, Bathing and Cooking
• Filters Out Dirt and Sediment, Automatic Self Cleaning, No Filters to Replace
• Great for Children and Adults with Sensitive Skin
• Inhibits the Growth of Bacteria, Fungi, Algae and Mold
• Reduces Some Heavy Metals Such as Lead, Copper, Iron, Nickel etc.

 

[box]

For those with water softeners, do you basically never have to worry about water stains and "soap scum" on your faucets, countertops, shower glass, and shower tiles? Is it that good?

Do modern day water softeners make the water feel "slimy" and "hard to wash off"?

That was another thing Falsken told me - that old water softeners use to have that slimy water feeling, but modern ones don't.

 

[CalBears96]

For those with water softeners, do you basically never have to worry about water stains and "soap scum" on your faucets, countertops, shower glass, and shower tiles? Is it that good?

Do modern day water softeners make the water feel "slimy" and "hard to wash off"?

That was another thing Falsken told me - that old water softeners use to have that slimy water feeling, but modern ones don't.

I still see water stains on my shower glass. It may be due to I live in Riverside county and the water there is extra hard.

I installed my water softener back in 2007, so I don't know if it's consider an older one, but the water does feel "slimy".

 

[zovall]

For those with water softeners, do you basically never have to worry about water stains and "soap scum" on your faucets, countertops, shower glass, and shower tiles? Is it that good?

Do modern day water softeners make the water feel "slimy" and "hard to wash off"?

That was another thing Falsken told me - that old water softeners use to have that slimy water feeling, but modern ones don't.

The water stains and soap scum are GREATLY reduced.
Yes, softened water (and I have a new one) will feel slimy but I've gotten used to it.

 

[hurijo]

Has anyone had trouble locating a proper drain for their softener? I've had 2 installers come out (including beloved Diamond Pure) and they couldn't locate a suitable drain. Walls of garage don't back to any obvious plumbing. There was the snake-out drain on the floor of the garage, but that means they would have to drill a hole and run the tubing across the garage floor and install a protective cover on top of tubing to protect it. I'm in house built in 2010.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

Very good point for people who are buying new builds. Always ask the builder to include water softener pre-plumbing! make sure the plumbing is such that only the indoor water is soft but the irrigation water for outside plants is still hard (and extra hose for soft water for car washing).

Has anyone had trouble locating a proper drain for their softener? I've had 2 installers come out (including beloved Diamond Pure) and they couldn't locate a suitable drain. Walls of garage don't back to any obvious plumbing. There was the snake-out drain on the floor of the garage, but that means they would have to drill a hole and run the tubing across the garage floor and install a protective cover on top of tubing to protect it. I'm in house built in 2010.

 

[zovall]

Has anyone had trouble locating a proper drain for their softener? I've had 2 installers come out (including beloved Diamond Pure) and they couldn't locate a suitable drain. Walls of garage don't back to any obvious plumbing. There was the snake-out drain on the floor of the garage, but that means they would have to drill a hole and run the tubing across the garage floor and install a protective cover on top of tubing to protect it. I'm in house built in 2010.

Where is your laundry room located?

 

[CalBears96]

Has anyone had trouble locating a proper drain for their softener? I've had 2 installers come out (including beloved Diamond Pure) and they couldn't locate a suitable drain. Walls of garage don't back to any obvious plumbing. There was the snake-out drain on the floor of the garage, but that means they would have to drill a hole and run the tubing across the garage floor and install a protective cover on top of tubing to protect it. I'm in house built in 2010.

Where is your laundry room located?

Most likely upstairs, from what I've seen on the new constructions in Irvine/Lake Forest.

In my current home, my laundry room is right next to the garage, basically at the entrance to the house from the garage, so the drain for the softener is easily done.

 

[hurijo]

Yup, laundry is on 2nd floor on opposite of the house as garage.

 

[potsticker]

My guess is the conditioner is a "salt-free" treatment option for Irvine Pacific buyers because it's more favorable in the eyes of IRWD. They have a whole section on their site about how bad salt softeners are:https://www.irwd.com/save-water-money/residential-water-treatment-devices

At any rate, if I had a choice, I would've just gone with the softener. But, I'm not going to uninstall the conditioner...might as well have some double-barrel action going.

There is a problem with your guess, though. The conditioner does not soften water.

This is from Falsken's website:

The Real Truth About Water Conditioners

• These units do not produce soft water. If you test the water hardness entering the unit and the water hardness leaving the unit, there will be no reduction in the hardness.
• These units should never be sold as a solution for hard water issues.

What Can I Expect From A Water Conditioner

• Better Tasting Water Throughout the House
• Reduces the Chlorine and Chloramine Content for Showering, Bathing and Cooking
• Filters Out Dirt and Sediment, Automatic Self Cleaning, No Filters to Replace
• Great for Children and Adults with Sensitive Skin
• Inhibits the Growth of Bacteria, Fungi, Algae and Mold
• Reduces Some Heavy Metals Such as Lead, Copper, Iron, Nickel etc.

Never said a conditioner softened water. I'm saying that my belief is the design center is pitching conditioners as a salt-free water treatment solution. Or, a more economical alternative. With a little research, it's clear that a conditioner isn't a 1-for-1 substitute for a softener.

 

[CalBears96]

My guess is the conditioner is a "salt-free" treatment option for Irvine Pacific buyers because it's more favorable in the eyes of IRWD. They have a whole section on their site about how bad salt softeners are:https://www.irwd.com/save-water-money/residential-water-treatment-devices

At any rate, if I had a choice, I would've just gone with the softener. But, I'm not going to uninstall the conditioner...might as well have some double-barrel action going.

There is a problem with your guess, though. The conditioner does not soften water.

This is from Falsken's website:

The Real Truth About Water Conditioners

• These units do not produce soft water. If you test the water hardness entering the unit and the water hardness leaving the unit, there will be no reduction in the hardness.
• These units should never be sold as a solution for hard water issues.

What Can I Expect From A Water Conditioner

• Better Tasting Water Throughout the House
• Reduces the Chlorine and Chloramine Content for Showering, Bathing and Cooking
• Filters Out Dirt and Sediment, Automatic Self Cleaning, No Filters to Replace
• Great for Children and Adults with Sensitive Skin
• Inhibits the Growth of Bacteria, Fungi, Algae and Mold
• Reduces Some Heavy Metals Such as Lead, Copper, Iron, Nickel etc.

Never said a conditioner softened water. I'm saying that my belief is the design center is pitching conditioners as a salt-free water treatment solution. Or, a more economical alternative. With a little research, it's clear that a conditioner isn't a 1-for-1 substitute for a softener.

What I meant was, whatever the design center was pitching, it's really misleading. A conditioner and a softener does different jobs, so to say that it's more favorable in the eyes of IRWD doesn't make any sense.