bkshopr_IHB
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..
Why are Houses are All Stucco in Irvine?
- Thread starter bkshopr_IHB
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EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
IIRC, there are many homes in Floral Park that are plaster walled. While it's supposedly a pain to do any work in the walls (such as, install AC and vents therefor), it is also supposed to be more temperate. In other words, it stays cooler in warm weather and warmer in cool weather. Stucco and drywall, not so much. Is plaster passe, or too expensive?
bkshopr_IHB
New member
<p> </p>
<p>Older homes unfortunately are not insulated in their wall cavity and attic. Lots of energy is lost through the roof and walls. Construction of interior walls consisted plaster thus has a better insulation value than drywalls but the hollow wall cavity is a huge compromise. Most of these vintage homes already have diffusers in the floor or near the base of the walls it is easy to add an AC utilizing the existing duct works. The raised foundation or crawl space makes the installation easy. Be aware of older duct works made from asbestos concrete that may be a health risk if crumbled.</p>
<p>Plaster is very expensive and only a few artisan can do a good job. Many high end homes in Shady Canyon have plaster interior. Most homes in Floral Park have plaster interior and plaster crown moldings.</p>
<p>Older homes unfortunately are not insulated in their wall cavity and attic. Lots of energy is lost through the roof and walls. Construction of interior walls consisted plaster thus has a better insulation value than drywalls but the hollow wall cavity is a huge compromise. Most of these vintage homes already have diffusers in the floor or near the base of the walls it is easy to add an AC utilizing the existing duct works. The raised foundation or crawl space makes the installation easy. Be aware of older duct works made from asbestos concrete that may be a health risk if crumbled.</p>
<p>Plaster is very expensive and only a few artisan can do a good job. Many high end homes in Shady Canyon have plaster interior. Most homes in Floral Park have plaster interior and plaster crown moldings.</p>
Bubblegum_IHB
New member
Plaster is expensive and labor intensive. As you mentioned it's difficult to work with once up on the walls, it can be brittle (bad for earthquakes) and cracks can develop. There's more prep work behind the wall for support between the 16" oc studs. Drywall is far easier to install and work with can be patched easily.
bkshopr_IHB
New member
<p>Bubblegum,</p>
<p>I agree with you totally. Most construction techniques todays are developed for the layman, unskilled laborers and Tim Allen weekend warriors. Time is a big factor in any projects today. The ease of repair and patching over mistake is also a consideration in developing new construction products. </p>
<p>The art of artisan and craftsman have been lured to career like stock broker, mortgage bankers and website designers. Ask any kid what he or she want to be when they grow up. Not a single one want to be a craftsman.</p>
<p>I agree with you totally. Most construction techniques todays are developed for the layman, unskilled laborers and Tim Allen weekend warriors. Time is a big factor in any projects today. The ease of repair and patching over mistake is also a consideration in developing new construction products. </p>
<p>The art of artisan and craftsman have been lured to career like stock broker, mortgage bankers and website designers. Ask any kid what he or she want to be when they grow up. Not a single one want to be a craftsman.</p>
graphrix_IHB
New member
<p>bkshopr,</p>
<p>I am continually impressed with your obscure yet fascinating and knowledgable topics. I believe in continuing education and you keep that going for me. I hope you continue posting here because you add a serious value to subjects that would take hours and hours of research. </p>
<p>You wouldn't happen to have a topic in mind for the main blog would you? If you do I think it would be a great addition to have your knowledge exposed to a broader readership. Either way just keep them coming.</p>
<p>How is that you have so much knowledge of Floral Park in Santa Ana? If you don't mind me asking of course.</p>
<p>I am continually impressed with your obscure yet fascinating and knowledgable topics. I believe in continuing education and you keep that going for me. I hope you continue posting here because you add a serious value to subjects that would take hours and hours of research. </p>
<p>You wouldn't happen to have a topic in mind for the main blog would you? If you do I think it would be a great addition to have your knowledge exposed to a broader readership. Either way just keep them coming.</p>
<p>How is that you have so much knowledge of Floral Park in Santa Ana? If you don't mind me asking of course.</p>
Major Schadenfreude_IHB
New member
"Bren frequented Spain, Italy, and Northern Africa similar to Southern California latitude and climate for material and aesthetic inspiration"
I think a lot of people wish he had left the idea of high-density housing back in Old Towne Europe!
PS: Thanks for the interesting post Bkshpr!
I think a lot of people wish he had left the idea of high-density housing back in Old Towne Europe!
PS: Thanks for the interesting post Bkshpr!
reason_IHB
New member
<p>Bk,</p>
<p>I drove around Floral Park a few weeks back. I love the neighborhood. The RE agent mentioned that no 2 houses are alike because they had been custom built? Is that true?</p>
<p>I drove around Floral Park a few weeks back. I love the neighborhood. The RE agent mentioned that no 2 houses are alike because they had been custom built? Is that true?</p>
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
Yes. They were built mostly between WWI and WWII. More info <a href="http://www.floralpark.com/index_files/page0001.htm">here</a>.
bkshopr_IHB
New member
<p>Graphix,</p>
<p>I have been involved with many masterplan projects through out California. It is part of my job to educate my clients regarding the various classic vintage communities that continue to attract the affluents and retain their high real estates value. I studied the formula and the success of these by gone era neighborhoods. They all have two common threads: tasteful and restraint architecture and pride of enduring home ownership (no flipper and few renters in the neighborhood).</p>
<p>Rancho Santa Fe, Hope Ranch, Montecito, Piedmont, Berkeley Hills, Bel Air, San Marino, Palos Vardes, Rolling Hills, Atherton, Los Gatos, Homby Hills, Los Feliz, La Canada Flinridge, Old Claremont, Hancock Park and Floral Park are just some of the communities that I case studied over the years. I also studied many other vintage communities in the Midwest and East Coast.</p>
<p>I have been involved with the Irvine Ranch since the last recession and learned a lot regarding the endless product array and their topology. </p>
<p>I just love to learn.</p>
<p>I have been involved with many masterplan projects through out California. It is part of my job to educate my clients regarding the various classic vintage communities that continue to attract the affluents and retain their high real estates value. I studied the formula and the success of these by gone era neighborhoods. They all have two common threads: tasteful and restraint architecture and pride of enduring home ownership (no flipper and few renters in the neighborhood).</p>
<p>Rancho Santa Fe, Hope Ranch, Montecito, Piedmont, Berkeley Hills, Bel Air, San Marino, Palos Vardes, Rolling Hills, Atherton, Los Gatos, Homby Hills, Los Feliz, La Canada Flinridge, Old Claremont, Hancock Park and Floral Park are just some of the communities that I case studied over the years. I also studied many other vintage communities in the Midwest and East Coast.</p>
<p>I have been involved with the Irvine Ranch since the last recession and learned a lot regarding the endless product array and their topology. </p>
<p>I just love to learn.</p>
bkshopr_IHB
New member
<p>Reason,</p>
<p>The agent is right. There are 623 period homes in Floral Park and no two houses alike. There were a dozen of unfortunate remodels and tear downs. The replacements do not measure up to the pedigree standard of the existing homes. The good thing is that in Floral Park that there is plenty of front yard room for many pounds of landscape to cover up the bad architecture. Good setback is the ingredient to make any home looks much better. </p>
<p>The agent is right. There are 623 period homes in Floral Park and no two houses alike. There were a dozen of unfortunate remodels and tear downs. The replacements do not measure up to the pedigree standard of the existing homes. The good thing is that in Floral Park that there is plenty of front yard room for many pounds of landscape to cover up the bad architecture. Good setback is the ingredient to make any home looks much better. </p>
reason_IHB
New member
<p>bk,</p>
<p>What is your thought on "west Floral Park"? Is this just a label associated to the actual Floral Park that realtor use to market?</p>
<p>What is your thought on "west Floral Park"? Is this just a label associated to the actual Floral Park that realtor use to market?</p>
graphrix_IHB
New member
<p>bkshopr,</p>
<p>I love to learn too. I refer to myself as an ubernerd because I have to continue my education constantly. </p>
<p>I am curious on your thoughts of Piedmont and Berkeley Hills. I lived next to Piedmont up the street from the Grand Lake theatre when I was going to school in the city. My cousin lives in the Oakland Hills in a house that avoided the fire. There is a very wide range of styles of homes there now because of the fire. The Rockridge area is still one of my favorite areas in all of Cali. Plus there is a Tapas bar that is phenomenal there.</p>
<p>Like I said before I think a post from you on the blog would be a great addition. You wouldn't have to be a regular but maybe a post on the architecture of Irvine would be good. Of course confidentiality is an issue and if it is a concern of yours I can assure you that it will stay that way. That is a major concern of mine. Again either way keep them coming. </p>
<p>I love to learn too. I refer to myself as an ubernerd because I have to continue my education constantly. </p>
<p>I am curious on your thoughts of Piedmont and Berkeley Hills. I lived next to Piedmont up the street from the Grand Lake theatre when I was going to school in the city. My cousin lives in the Oakland Hills in a house that avoided the fire. There is a very wide range of styles of homes there now because of the fire. The Rockridge area is still one of my favorite areas in all of Cali. Plus there is a Tapas bar that is phenomenal there.</p>
<p>Like I said before I think a post from you on the blog would be a great addition. You wouldn't have to be a regular but maybe a post on the architecture of Irvine would be good. Of course confidentiality is an issue and if it is a concern of yours I can assure you that it will stay that way. That is a major concern of mine. Again either way keep them coming. </p>
Trooper_IHB
New member
bk, Yes, thank you for the quirky and insightful posts. Hancock Park is my favorite neighborhood in all of L.A....stunning houses and streets.
bkshopr_IHB
New member
America was fascinated by the idea of Ranch House invented by Cliff May in the 1940’s. He was never an architect but a home designer. Prior to the 40’s he designed Spanish Revival homes with a lot of charm and whimsical windows and romantic flairs. He then realized all the windows from the period architectural styles are just too narrow and vertical. He wanted to increase the width of the glass and create an expansive vision to the outdoor to heighten the indoor outdoor relationship. The ranch houses was able to adapt corner windows that none of the period style was able to do.
All the period homes had a formal living and dining room. The kitchen was compartmentalized for domestic servants. Cliff May saw the changing family lifestyle and invented the single story ranch house that emphasizes horizontality. Televisions and Radio replaced the piano in the Living parlor for home entertainment. He invented a ” family room” to house these new gadgets and also allowing a much casual messy room for the family gatherings. This room must be oriented toward the back yard for privacy and the mess is not seen by the neighbors.
Prior to that time backyard were for utility use and not for enjoyment. He created new life for the backyard. He sometime splayed the bedroom wings at an angle to embrace another one of his invention a kidney shaped pool. He also invented the BBQ grille and the expansive sliding glass door. He removed the detached garage from the back of the property and moved it next to the house with a breezeway in between for doing practical garden chores and washing the dog. He also opened the enclosed kitchen to relate visually to the family room along with a casual eating area which he named the “nook”. He hated the closet behind a single door so he invented the linear strip closet. By the 40’s there were a huge decline of domestic maids and cooks. Mom took on the role cooking and polishing the newly invented Formica. The front yard became neglected as the important rooms were situated toward the back. The porches became a token element and eventually were deleted in the later ranch houses.
West Floral Park was a product of the 1940’s. As one drives through Floral Park and West Floral Park the neighborhood character changed totally. I personally prefer Floral Park’s period styles because they are more engaging and friendlier toward the front of the street whereas the Ranch houses in West Floral Park turn its back away from the street and focus more to the rear of the property. The extrovert period styles appear more inviting than the introvert ranch houses.
All the period homes had a formal living and dining room. The kitchen was compartmentalized for domestic servants. Cliff May saw the changing family lifestyle and invented the single story ranch house that emphasizes horizontality. Televisions and Radio replaced the piano in the Living parlor for home entertainment. He invented a ” family room” to house these new gadgets and also allowing a much casual messy room for the family gatherings. This room must be oriented toward the back yard for privacy and the mess is not seen by the neighbors.
Prior to that time backyard were for utility use and not for enjoyment. He created new life for the backyard. He sometime splayed the bedroom wings at an angle to embrace another one of his invention a kidney shaped pool. He also invented the BBQ grille and the expansive sliding glass door. He removed the detached garage from the back of the property and moved it next to the house with a breezeway in between for doing practical garden chores and washing the dog. He also opened the enclosed kitchen to relate visually to the family room along with a casual eating area which he named the “nook”. He hated the closet behind a single door so he invented the linear strip closet. By the 40’s there were a huge decline of domestic maids and cooks. Mom took on the role cooking and polishing the newly invented Formica. The front yard became neglected as the important rooms were situated toward the back. The porches became a token element and eventually were deleted in the later ranch houses.
West Floral Park was a product of the 1940’s. As one drives through Floral Park and West Floral Park the neighborhood character changed totally. I personally prefer Floral Park’s period styles because they are more engaging and friendlier toward the front of the street whereas the Ranch houses in West Floral Park turn its back away from the street and focus more to the rear of the property. The extrovert period styles appear more inviting than the introvert ranch houses.
EvaLSeraphim_IHB
New member
BK- I, too, would like to add my thanks for sharing your knowledge.