San Mateo vs Sage vs Laguna Altura ??

[socaltrojan81]

Hi Folks,

I've been looking at existing homes in south county (mostly Ladera) for a while now with no luck. So I'm now considering the newer homes in Irvine.

What is your take on San Mateo, Sage and Laguna Altura ?  What would you go far and why?

Also, are Irvine Pacific and KB homes providing any incentives? (closing costs, landscaping, etc?)

Thanks

 

[vikas420]

There are no incentives for san mateo's from Irvine pacific..They seem to be selling very well right now from what i have been gathering...don't think IP has any reason for incentives on them..

 

[The Motor Court Company]

to be precise, you are comparing these 3 starter detached homes
1. San Mateo II in SG
2. Sage in PS
3. Sienna in LA

In terms of $ per sqft, with mello roos and taxes, HOA and base price,
Sienna costs the most and Sage is the best value wise.

In terms of location, I will look at different criteria.
1. School. Sienna has access to the best IUSD schools, while SMII and Sage share the same access to the next tier. SMII gets the edge over Sage because of proximity to elementary school.

2. Weather. Sienna is the best because much closer to the ocean. SMII gets slightly edge over Sage.

3. Convenience. Sienna is arguably the best with easy access to 405. Sage is the worst.

4. Environmental. Sienna is dead last because it is so close to 405, the noise and pollution cannot be ignored. While Sage and SMII are closer to the active landfill, the landfill is not leaking yet and it remains a myth whether you can smell the landfill in PS. I will take something that is effective 24/7 over something that might or might not occur.

5. Amenities. I will rank Sienna last because it is so far from the pool. The two other passive parks are also disappointing due to lack of parking and restrooms.

Overall I think Sienna is very overpriced because TIC charges a hefty premium for 1~3 but no compensation for 4&5.
SMII is ahead of Sage because KB is known to be a crappy builder, although IPAC is not that much better. After you consider the location and KB brand, the value you get from Sage is probably not so great.

In general the sales pace supports my ranking: that SMII is selling very fast, Sienna is a very slow mover and Sage is very slow as it already has a few MLS listings since grand opening.

 

[akim997]

Sienna is a slow mover because its a high priced san mateo.  It's the closest development to the 405 in LA.  In speaking with prospective buyers, alot of people these days dont care about that.  Sienna does have some homes that are against the closest portion to the 405 that do come with driveways which is nice.  They will charge a premium for these, but of course, wont offset it due to the proximity to the freeway. 

I'm a future resident of Stonegate, and its not the greatest place.  I like that the school is in the community, but overall its less attractive than Woodbury.  San Mateo II is nice because they are San Marcos sized lots (I think) which are a little bigger.  But at the price of San Mateo II, I think you'd take a look at Saratoga 1 to get an extra bedroom. 

Never been a fan of Sage or KB so I don't really have any comments about the development.

 

[irvinehomeowner]

Along with the poor layout, lack of amenities, and proximity to the 405 (good or bad)... the $295 HOA is ridiculous at Laguna Altura.

I have been tempted by Cortona but I can't get past that additional cost on top of the additional premium TIC puts on LA over basically the same models at Stonegate.

On the other hand, I'm not that fond of Stonegate's location either and I think that is something you would have to contend with depending on where you work and/or where you tend to circulate.

 

[socaltrojan81]

Great info everybody..How about the slightly larger Lot sizes at Sage? They are ~3000 sqft which is definitely bigger than Sienna and SMII. Is the lot size not a factor for you folks?

Also, what's the broker coop like at these three properties (SMII, Sage and Sienna). I have been to SMII,Sienna and many others and I know I gave my info somewhere...just can't remember where! Darn! Hope its not too late.

In terms of $ per sqft, with mello roos and taxes, HOA and base price,
Sienna costs the most and Sage is the best value wise.

In terms of location, I will look at different criteria.
1. School. Sienna has access to the best IUSD schools, while SMII and Sage share the same access to the next tier. SMII gets the edge over Sage because of proximity to elementary school.

2. Weather. Sienna is the best because much closer to the ocean. SMII gets slightly edge over Sage.

3. Convenience. Sienna is arguably the best with easy access to 405. Sage is the worst.

4. Environmental. Sienna is dead last because it is so close to 405, the noise and pollution cannot be ignored. While Sage and SMII are closer to the active landfill, the landfill is not leaking yet and it remains a myth whether you can smell the landfill in PS. I will take something that is effective 24/7 over something that might or might not occur.

5. Amenities. I will rank Sienna last because it is so far from the pool. The two other passive parks are also disappointing due to lack of parking and restrooms.

Overall I think Sienna is very overpriced because TIC charges a hefty premium for 1~3 but no compensation for 4&5.
SMII is ahead of Sage because KB is known to be a crappy builder, although IPAC is not that much better. After you consider the location and KB brand, the value you get from Sage is probably not so great.

In general the sales pace supports my ranking: that SMII is selling very fast, Sienna is a very slow mover and Sage is very slow as it already has a few MLS listings since grand opening.

 

[javacly]

Those bigger backyard have lot premium and Sage have Elevation premium as well.

 

[changm55]

i went with LA... in late may/ early june when i signed they offered me free landscaping, but i think my phase was the last that they offered... in fact i think all the communities have actually increased the base home price for all models by a few thousand since early june, so if thats the case, theres no way IP will be offering incentives right now... but dunno, some ppl speculate price will come down again later in the winter so u might have better luck if u have the luxury to wait it out and see

i think each community has its own personality, neighbors, age group, perks... so id suggest just spending some time to walk around the park and surrounding areas (not just around the model homes) to see which one appeals to u the most... that way u can also get a feel of the intangible things that appeal to uniquely to u...

 

[changm55]

Great info everybody..How about the slightly larger Lot sizes at Sage? They are ~3000 sqft which is definitely bigger than Sienna and SMII. Is the lot size not a factor for you folks?

Also, what's the broker coop like at these three properties (SMII, Sage and Sienna). I have been to SMII,Sienna and many others and I know I gave my info somewhere...just can't remember where! Darn! Hope its not too late.

In terms of $ per sqft, with mello roos and taxes, HOA and base price,
Sienna costs the most and Sage is the best value wise.

In terms of location, I will look at different criteria.
1. School. Sienna has access to the best IUSD schools, while SMII and Sage share the same access to the next tier. SMII gets the edge over Sage because of proximity to elementary school.

2. Weather. Sienna is the best because much closer to the ocean. SMII gets slightly edge over Sage.

3. Convenience. Sienna is arguably the best with easy access to 405. Sage is the worst.

4. Environmental. Sienna is dead last because it is so close to 405, the noise and pollution cannot be ignored. While Sage and SMII are closer to the active landfill, the landfill is not leaking yet and it remains a myth whether you can smell the landfill in PS. I will take something that is effective 24/7 over something that might or might not occur.

5. Amenities. I will rank Sienna last because it is so far from the pool. The two other passive parks are also disappointing due to lack of parking and restrooms.

Overall I think Sienna is very overpriced because TIC charges a hefty premium for 1~3 but no compensation for 4&5.
SMII is ahead of Sage because KB is known to be a crappy builder, although IPAC is not that much better. After you consider the location and KB brand, the value you get from Sage is probably not so great.

In general the sales pace supports my ranking: that SMII is selling very fast, Sienna is a very slow mover and Sage is very slow as it already has a few MLS listings since grand opening.

this is exactly what i meant... everybody has their own priorities and appeals... im unmarried just turned 31... if i had a wife to help me clean, i would probably do a portola springs 3000 sq/ft lol... but at the moment i dont really need it nor do i think i can outgrow my current 4bedroom in the next 5 years (unless i decide to pick back my expensive tshirt printing hobby again which will take up an entire room just for it)... i picked LA just cause i personally felt its the most isolated and tranquil of the 3 neighborhoods (i had to sorta imagine what each community would be like after they were all fully built up which was kind of hard cause its all like flat land )... the HOA annoys me but didnt stop me from pulling the trigger

i guess if u dont mind, would u care to share some of ur priorities just so we can have a better idea of what appeals to you? much easier to compare the different communities if we know what ur top 3 home purchasing criterias are... also if u dont mind resale homes in irvine, then u arent limited to the new communities and thats a lot more options too...

dont mind the broker coop until u decide on a home and want to sign the PA... i didnt tell the sales ppl OR my broker until a week before i decided i was going to sign the PA even though i was going back and forth with the sales for about 2-3 months already asking them a bunch of questions... IP wasnt happy but they still allowed my broker to get the money... but then again thats just me... i have no problem breaking hell, being in ur face, or an asshole in general particularly with IP... bitching out IP ppl in their face definitely helps me in dealing with my hate part of the relationship in my love hate relationship with IP

 

[akim997]

We really liked Cortona and were close to pulling the trigger, but the price was just too high, especially when you factor in the 295 HOA and 600 Mellos.  The plan 2 Cortona is really nice, but it was at an 80K premium over its Stonegate brethren.  That + the location issues we had made us go to Stonegate.  We also considered plan 1 Cortona vs. plan 2 Maricopa but decided that Maricopa fit us better.  Funny thing is that's the most unpopular model at Maricopa (9 left).  Comments I've heard include that its too expensive for a standard 4BR house and people don't see the value of "bigger rooms" like the larger bedroom downstairs or large great room or kitchen.  I find this interesting because at the same time people complain that other developments have spaces that are too small. 

 

[changm55]

We really liked Cortona and were close to pulling the trigger, but the price was just too high, especially when you factor in the 295 HOA and 600 Mellos.  The plan 2 Cortona is really nice, but it was at an 80K premium over its Stonegate brethren.  That + the location issues we had made us go to Stonegate.  We also considered plan 1 Cortona vs. plan 2 Maricopa but decided that Maricopa fit us better.  Funny thing is that's the most unpopular model at Maricopa (9 left).  Comments I've heard include that its too expensive for a standard 4BR house and people don't see the value of "bigger rooms" like the larger bedroom downstairs or large great room or kitchen.  I find this interesting because at the same time people complain that other developments have spaces that are too small.

haha same with me lol... i squatted on a lot in order to wait for the next phase release and i was so happy when the phase came out and the lot i wanted was available while my 2nd and 3rd priority lots were taken instead... later after i got the price sheet i found out the other lots had some premiums associated with them while mine didnt (now that i think back, i dont know why i didnt asked the sales ppl the pricing since they usually know the pricing in advance to new phases)... i guess i like what other ppl dont like hahaha

 

[javacly]

Few months back, I had the same dilemma over Sage or SM II.
Instead of listing the positives of each development, these are my list of negatives (Some of my points are influenced by needs of my kids) and it maybe another person's positive.

Sage
- Hood + Microwave + stove setup like a rental apartment.
- Think SM have more standard than Sage (recessed lights, crown molding and etc)
- High MR and HOA
- 2-3 more minutes drive out to.. e.g Woodbury's Ralphs. (with kids, every minutes count)
- Standard yard is small, need to pay more to have what the model home have.
- Future development plans (school, mall ) may change because of Great Park development.
      - maybe more rental apartments and low-income housing since Portola is not fully developed yet.
- can?t walk to Stonegate elementary
- walk-able distance to 1 park (tomato spring park)

San Mateo II
- lack of shower in master bath (standard is bath tub for plan 1 and 2)
- floor plan doesn?t really fully utilized the space
- no solar panel (standard in sage)
- cookie cutter home (floor plan repeat over and over)
- 2 rental apartments and 1 low income apartment in SG
- Lack of privacy, density too high

 

[changm55]

To all,

Be weary of The Motor Court Company's posts

User is known to either subtly or forcefully push personal thoughts, scare tactics, derogatory, and racist remarks as a method to subject his biases onto other forum members.  Commonly known as being an asshole.

Below are some examples from recent forum activity.  READER BEWARE

examples of MCC using personal thoughts, scare tactics, and other means to PUSH his point... READER BEWARE

Stay away from El Camino Real unless your budget demands it. It is among the least desirable neighborhoods in Irvine.

for toxic risk, it needs to be 3CWG + RV length driveway + single story home for me to consider.

I am sorry I am not Chinese so I do not welcome lower standards.

to be fair, in another thread, there is some comparison between LA and SG in terms to distance to major places (Costco, Target, 85 degree...etc) and LA can come out ahead depending on your life style. But certainly grocery stores and walkability to schools have high priority because you do these the most often.

For the swimming pool, LA has 600 total units for 1 pool. SG at build out (the max limit is 3100, 700~1000 of them being apartments, I had the exact numbers at home) so that means about 600 or less units for each pool (4 pools). So in that sense it is quite comparable. Unit to pool ratio LR is the best and Woodbury is not too bad, although apartment dwellers in WB can also access the pools.

My biggest gripe for the two LA pocket parks is the lack of rest rooms and ample parking space. Sienna and San Remo owners are already at far distance to these parks and there are no rest rooms and parking! Imagine you have 4 little potty trained kids and every time you bring them to these parks, if any one of them needs to potty you have to bring the whole gang with you and walk home!

It is like TIC giving a big middle finger to these owners that not only they pay more than SG counter parts, but also have very limited access to parks.  these units also serve as the noise and pollutant buffer for the two wealthier neighborhoods. Most Asians owners are smart and see this through and no wonder these are slow selling.

Is San Mateo the new normal? it looks like it outsells the sister product Sienna by quite a lot. I mean starter detached homes with tiny backyard and no driveways?

Do Asian people shy away from Sienna because it is too close to the 405 that they mistakenly think it is for low income housing?

no it is more about decreasing civility in Irvine because of Chinese immigrants.

more low income housing by the freeways?

Good observations. Great Wall is a Chinese national pride and walling individual neighborhoods give additional sense of segregation and security. At least it clearly defines the boundaries of each neighborhood, making comparison and gloating much easier.

No Laguna Altura is not worse than Stonegate, or some people will argue it is better. At least TIC is charging a premium on LA over SG and I won't bet against TIC.
And to be fair, I did mention the positive things about LA - south of 405, better climate, best schools in Irvine, isolated feeling...etc. I am just not willing to live that close to major freeways and pay a premium to get all of the above.

For a landfill that is not leaking, 1.5~2 miles is acceptable to me.

checked out Laguna Altura again this past Saturday - for the new "view" park. So glad we did not choose LA because we were reminded how noisy this whole community can get. I cannot imagine buying a house and forced to shut off my windows all the time because the noise from 405 and 133 are so deafening. Frankly even if it is free, I will not live this close to the freeways. Only hobos live this close to freeways.

QFPD

all jokes aside,
Laguna Altura does enjoy a cooler climate and is zoned for Irvine's best schools. It is also quite isolated and with the topography you can argue it is among the best Zombie defending villages in Irvine. While overpriced, the two SFR tracts are not a terrible deal due to the better location and closer the main park.

Sienna and San Remo remind me of slums. Closest to 405, no amenities, no parking...just rows after rows of super compact motor court homes.

the best way to avoid air pollution is distance. Elevation, wind direction...etc are not as effective. LA is in a bowl shape so it actually traps the smog (the gases that hurt children's respiratory systems are the very fine particles that you won't see accumulate on the exterior window). From air pollution point of view, Stonegate and Woodbury easily beats out Laguna Altura. For having a more mild climate and better schools Laguna Altura easily beats the other two. There is really no argument here. You either choose between your children's health or everything else.

 

[The Motor Court Company]

looks like somebody is very pissed because he cannot argue with the facts and his favorite neighborhood is being outsold by other developments.

 

[changm55]

looks like somebody is very pissed because he cannot argue with the facts and his favorite neighborhood is being outsold by other developments.

no, i just like trolling ur ass just like how u used to troll me, i learn from the best, but im young so i bring it to a whole new level sir...

 

[The Motor Court Company]

Cool. So you admitted you are trolling and I am the best. QFPE.

looks like somebody is very pissed because he cannot argue with the facts and his favorite neighborhood is being outsold by other developments.

no, i just like trolling ur ass just like how u used to troll me, i learn from the best

 

[changm55]

Cool. So you admitted you are trolling and I am the best. QFPE.

looks like somebody is very pissed because he cannot argue with the facts and his favorite neighborhood is being outsold by other developments.

no, i just like trolling ur ass just like how u used to troll me, i learn from the best

hahaha... im still waiting for ur replies to my points on the other HOA thread on ur so called "facts"... sound more like rhetoric to me... look who is trying to steer off the subject again?

still waiting for u to bring it man... gettin bored here

dont tell me ur pussing out again like last time...

 

[socaltrojan81]

Do you or anybody here remember what the prices were like for San Mateo Residence 1 few months ago and are they generally negotiable on the base price? How much have the prices increased?

Thanks guys.

Few months back, I had the same dilemma over Sage or SM II.
Instead of listing the positives of each development, these are my list of negatives (Some of my points are influenced by needs of my kids) and it maybe another person's positive.

Sage
- Hood + Microwave + stove setup like a rental apartment.
- Think SM have more standard than Sage (recessed lights, crown molding and etc)
- High MR and HOA
- 2-3 more minutes drive out to.. e.g Woodbury's Ralphs. (with kids, every minutes count)
- Standard yard is small, need to pay more to have what the model home have.
- Future development plans (school, mall ) may change because of Great Park development.
      - maybe more rental apartments and low-income housing since Portola is not fully developed yet.
- can?t walk to Stonegate elementary
- walk-able distance to 1 park (tomato spring park)

San Mateo II
- lack of shower in master bath (standard is bath tub for plan 1 and 2)
- floor plan doesn?t really fully utilized the space
- no solar panel (standard in sage)
- cookie cutter home (floor plan repeat over and over)
- 2 rental apartments and 1 low income apartment in SG
- Lack of privacy, density too high