Irvine Pacific Open Wall Walk-Through

[lucky760]

Had our open wall (or what they call "dusty shoes") walk-through on our IP build recently and had a few... worries I thought I'd share.

First of all, we made a couple of structural upgrades that were very obviously not being built. (E.g., there's a wall where an opening should be.) That was our biggest concern. Really, they just completely ignored multiple upgrades? : ((

Aside from that, there was a good chunk of wood coming apart from a 2x4. Our guide simply pulled it off and simply stated that it's no problem and he's sure the inspector will force them to fix it somehow.

He also pointed out how they smartly have metal plates on the edge of any 2x4 wherever there are any wires passing through that stud. This is so that if you hammer a nail into the wall later, the nail will prevent you from nailing into the wires inside. After that I saw more than half of the studs on a wall randomly with no metal plate in front of the wires passing through. His first response was to say he didn't know why they'd do that, but after thinking for a moment he assured that it's because in some of the studs the wires are a little further back so there's less chance of them being hit with a nail. Despite that proclamation, I saw lots of plates in other places where the wires were much further back.

Those were our main problems during the walk-through and it left is feeling a bit underwhelmed and disappointed in their apparent lack of quality. I know we shouldn't expect any more from IP than we'd get from KB, but we just do. That's especially because we're dropping 3/4 of a million dollars on a condominium near a landfill (although it is one of the biggest in California, I'll have you know : p ).

We thought about having a professional inspector with us, but after a horror story from another TI member, it seems it would be a waste of time and money since IP will ignore what your inspector says, if they even allow your inspector in at all.

Anyhow, any other IP buyers having any kind of similar experiences? Should we be [more] worried?

 

[ttl]

It's better not to know how sausages are made.

While our house was being built we visited the site everyday after work because it was right across the street. Believe me we found lots of worrisome workmanship on those visits. Crooked nails sticking out everywhere, switches and lights in the wrong position and at the wrong height. Wrong driveway paving, missing ventilation outlets on the roof, you name it.

Yes, I'd be worried and would keep a close watch. Point it out as soon as you see one and make sure it is addressed within reasonable period of time - a week or two.

 

[qwerty]

It's better not to know how sausages are made.

While our house was being built we visited the site everyday after work because it was right across the street. Believe me we found lots of worrisome workmanship on those visits. Crooked nails sticking out everywhere, switches and lights in the wrong position and at the wrong height. Wrong driveway paving, missing ventilation outlets on the roof, you name it.

Yes, I'd be worried and would keep a close watch. Point it out as soon as you see one and make sure it is addressed within reasonable period of time - a week or two.

did you mention all the things you would find? and did they fix them?

 

[freedomcm]

building code requires those metal plates when the wires are less than 1.5 inches from the surface of the stud.

if they put on extra, that is just sloppy, an extra expense for the builder, but not harmful in any way.

 

[changm55]

congrats on ur purchase!

when my home was being built, i visited the place every 2 weeks n when they told me to leave i just left (n came back later)... i also had steve come in to inspect the home (both predrywall n b4 closing)...

my site wasnt dirty n dangerous like other ppls nor did i have missing things here and there... but i had similar issues with the metal platings u mentioned... to me that was minor... rather my issues were more alignment related but i email them and once they fixed it they emailed me back verification pics since i could only go down every 2 weeks

the predrywall inspection had similar issues... nothing big... but again, the point is to have it documented that IP received that list, they acknowledged receipt + reviewed that list + and get on writing that they are gonna fix it... n thats it... whether they fixed it b4 the list goes on who knows? but point is just to make them know they are still liable for those fixes if shit goes down later on that we find out they didnt fix it... they do make u sign a waiver b4 they give u the keys so the best we can argue is predrywall fixes cant be verified at that point so we assumed IP kept their word (i was a bit of a dick and i made it clear to IP i chose to communicate via email exactly because i want a paper trail and refused to pick up my phone, so i forced their hand to have to respond to me via email and indirectly acknowledge that whatever they say via email can be used as a paper trail... this is just how i personally prefer to protect myself but its not the only way, other ppl have other ways and preferences, so whatever floats ur boat)

at this stage n time... if ur concerned, then email them an itemized list (hopefully u took pics of everything), have them confirm they will address those issues and thats that... beyond this, theres no point worrying and loosing sleep over it unless u want to go in there and fix things urself...

 

[ttl]

It's better not to know how sausages are made.

While our house was being built we visited the site everyday after work because it was right across the street. Believe me we found lots of worrisome workmanship on those visits. Crooked nails sticking out everywhere, switches and lights in the wrong position and at the wrong height. Wrong driveway paving, missing ventilation outlets on the roof, you name it.

Yes, I'd be worried and would keep a close watch. Point it out as soon as you see one and make sure it is addressed within reasonable period of time - a week or two.

did you mention all the things you would find? and did they fix them?

Of all the visible ones that we were able to verify, yes, those were all fixed.

 

[broda]

I agree the pre-drywall inspection was underwhelming.  They scheduled mine way before drywall would go up.  But they told me the construction foreman would ONLY allow that specific day.  I pointed out a number of issues I could visually see right off the bat, and the rep who does the walk through says oh they'll take care of that don't worry.  And every visit I did to the house prior to the drywall being up, never saw it taken care of once.  Sales reps are not helpful with that stuff either.  They say they will bring it up to the construction supervisor but it will never happen. 

They are so hell bent on meeting their deadline to churn out your house so they can make money on the next one...it doesn't matter what you point out to them.  Once the drywall is up, problem solved.  Recommendations? Take video, pictures, record every ounce of what they say.  Might not mean something immediately.  But it will be useful at some point.

What did I get from the whole experience?  When you see what your options you asked for look like prior to drywall.  It's a quick visual of how badly you're being raped on the mark up for items you know you did just out of convenience not to have to do it after the fact.

 

[sentosa]

Had our open wall (or what they call "dusty shoes") walk-through on our IP build recently and had a few... worries I thought I'd share.

Suggest you hire an inspector for preCo walk through. It's money well spent.
We hired Steve Lottatore from BIlt-Rite  for pre-drywall & preCo inspection for our new construction (note: I don't getting anything by recommending him). Steve's work is really detail oriented and professional. The inspection will include minor things like scrach, dent, paint as well as major safety issues/structure issues. It's very helpful to us.
Just my 2 cents.

 

[bimmerv]

Had our open wall (or what they call "dusty shoes") walk-through on our IP build recently and had a few... worries I thought I'd share.

Suggest you hire an inspector for preCo walk through. It's money well spent.
We hired Steve Lottatore from BIlt-Rite  for pre-drywall & preCo inspection for our new construction (note: I don't getting anything by recommending him). Steve's work is really detail oriented and professional. The inspection will include minor things like scrach, dent, paint as well as major safety issues/structure issues. It's very helpful to us.
Just my 2 cents.

Sentosa - Can you please tell how much did Bilt-Rite charge for the pre-drywall and preCo inspection?

 

[broda]

Funny I was told on final walk through not to bring a 3rd party inspector because that is frowned upon by the customer service guy.

 

[sentosa]

Sentosa - Can you please tell how much did Bilt-Rite charge for the pre-drywall and preCo inspection?

$400+- for about 2000 sqft. the bigger the more expensive. it will take about 3 hour.

 

[sentosa]

Funny I was told on final walk through not to bring a 3rd party inspector because that is frowned upon by the customer service guy.

That's true. I guess all builders hate inspector. That's why it makes even more sense to have yr own inspector, not just blindly trust the builder. Building a house is a very complicated project, many people will be doing different things. It's very easy to make mistakes and make lots of them.
It really doesn't matter if they like it or frown upon it, if there is something that violate the building code, they will have to fix it. If there is something that they are not going to fix and there is a problem later on, at least you will have a case by providing proof for the defect.

 

[lucky760]

Funny I was told on final walk through not to bring a 3rd party inspector because that is frowned upon by the customer service guy.

That's true. I guess all builders hate inspector. That's why it makes even more sense to have yr own inspector, not just blindly trust the builder. Building a house is a very complicated project, many people will be doing different things. It's very easy to make mistakes and make lots of them.
It really doesn't matter if they like it or frown upon it, if there is something that violate the building code, they will have to fix it. If there is something that they are not going to fix and there is a problem later on, at least you will have a case by providing proof for the defect.

That sounds good in theory, but in practice, it's really not that simple. The Talk Irvine member who told me about their experience with IP had to struggle with the sales office to finally allow him to bring in his 3rd-party inspector. The worst part, however, is that the inspector did find issues that he felt needed to be fixed and the buyer tried with the sales office and IP management and even the city's building inspector, but everyone refused to do anything about his issues.

There isn't much your inspection report is good for if everyone refuses to do anything about it. :\

 

[broda]

sounds pretty stupid right?  Please do not inspect our workmanship...it makes us uneasy and we don't like it when you find our mistakes.

 

[zubs]

TIC is the soup nazi, and you want their soup...Take it or leave it, because we got a line 5 miles long

Perhaps that is why Lambert Ranch did so well even with a dump 0.5 miles away.

 

[usctrojancpa]

TIC is the soup nazi, and you want their soup...Take it or leave it, because we got a line 5 miles long

Perhaps that is why Lambert Ranch did so well even with a dump 0.5 miles away.

No house for you!....NEXT

 

[Irvine_RC]

1st Time Poster here.  Figure I would share my similar experience with my walk-through with a different builder. (Standard Pacific).

I had a very similar unsatisfactory experience from Standard Pacific about 1 month ago with my walkthrough.

Standard Pacific did reluctantly allow my inspector (found Steve using the information on this forum) to come through for a pre-drywall inspection.  However, they just proceeded to put up drywall without really confirming that the issues were fixed.

I did get a "verbal assurance" from the construction manager on site that the issues would be addressed, but I HIGHLY doubt that is actually happened.  Luckily for me, most of the issues found were with those silly nail plates, which isn't the worst thing in the world.

 

[Irvinecommuter]

TIC is the soup nazi, and you want their soup...Take it or leave it, because we got a line 5 miles long

Perhaps that is why Lambert Ranch did so well even with a dump 0.5 miles away.

Yup.  Was told by our inspector that TIC only allows inspections 2X during the building process and does not allow him to visit the site at random.  They are the only builders who do this.  Personally, I think it's a dumb idea in the long term but whatever.

 

[broda]

I decided to stop being a hermit and talked to my neighbors.  We chatted about our experiences with closing and the walk through.  I have to say my experience was relatively smooth compared to some of these people.  One neighbor without an inspector found a laundry list of problems that he went over with the customer service rep.  Because the list was so long he had to call in his boss.  The boss proceeded to tell them, you can't expect perfection...if this was my house it wouldn't bother me.  Needless to say he went off on the guy and they are now looking into the issues. 

Some of the issues that I remember off the top of my head were misaligned doors, misaligned drawers (to the point they won't open correctly) and a large chunk of drywall missing on the bottom of his garage wall which he proceeded to tell them that was normal.... :-\

Imagine what a trained eye could find if us common folk notice these things.

 

[snut100]

I decided to stop being a hermit and talked to my neighbors.  We chatted about our experiences with closing and the walk through.  I have to say my experience was relatively smooth compared to some of these people.  One neighbor without an inspector found a laundry list of problems that he went over with the customer service rep.  Because the list was so long he had to call in his boss.  The boss proceeded to tell them, you can't expect perfection...if this was my house it wouldn't bother me.  Needless to say he went off on the guy and they are now looking into the issues. 

Some of the issues that I remember off the top of my head were misaligned doors, misaligned drawers (to the point they won't open correctly) and a large chunk of drywall missing on the bottom of his garage wall which he proceeded to tell them that was normal.... :-\

Imagine what a trained eye could find if us common folk notice these things.

Don't even call him a customer service guy.  Consider him a moron that doesn't know what he is doing.  He will spew more useless nonsense than those guys in the Sales Office.  I heard the same line before, if it's my house, I won't bother and you can't expect perfection.  You correct them by saying, it's my house and I paid a lot of money for it so it matters.  I am not asking for perfection, just for it to be done correctly.

This may prompt you for the, "we been building houses and stuff for over 50 years line."  In those 50 years, they haven't learned jack about customer service or quality.  Remind them that you have a fit and finish warranty of 1 year.  They will do their best to drag their feet for the 1 year.

Another famous line, I like is:  "that is a poor design, no matter what you do, it's not going to work properly."  Tell them you give them full permission to re-do the entire thing and make it work right.