House Democrats contemplate eliminating 401k tax breaks
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halfnote19_IHB
New member
<blockquote>Under Ghilarducci?s plan, all workers would receive a $600 annual inflation-adjusted subsidy from the U.S. government but would be required to invest 5 percent of their pay into a guaranteed retirement account administered by the Social Security Administration. </blockquote>
Yea... let's give more money to social security because they have done such a great job so far.
Yea... let's give more money to social security because they have done such a great job so far.
irvine123_IHB
New member
Here we go let's "spread the wealth"...
Now you don't have to save your own money, government will give EVERYONE money to save...
Now you don't have to save your own money, government will give EVERYONE money to save...
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
[quote author="irvine123" date=1224897561]Here we go let's "spread the wealth"...
Now you don't have to save your own money, government will give EVERYONE money to save...</blockquote>
I'm tempted to quit my job for this but I'm worried I might be standing in a soup line.
Now you don't have to save your own money, government will give EVERYONE money to save...</blockquote>
I'm tempted to quit my job for this but I'm worried I might be standing in a soup line.
[quote author="halfnote19" date=1224896988]<blockquote>Under Ghilarducci?s plan, all workers would receive a $600 annual inflation-adjusted subsidy from the U.S. government but would be required to invest 5 percent of their pay into a guaranteed retirement account administered by the Social Security Administration. </blockquote>
Yea... let's give more money to social security because they have done such a great job so far.</blockquote>
$50 a month in return for 5% of your income. If you make over $12k a year, that doesn't sound like too good of a deal...
Yea... let's give more money to social security because they have done such a great job so far.</blockquote>
$50 a month in return for 5% of your income. If you make over $12k a year, that doesn't sound like too good of a deal...
lendingmaestro_IHB
New member
what a scam
[quote author="skek" date=1224906012]WINEX, don't forget that whopping 3% return they are going to guarantee us. I think Argentina is trying something similar. I wonder how that's working out?</blockquote>
Skek, repeat after me:
There is no such thing as inflation. There is no such thing as inflation.
Skek, repeat after me:
There is no such thing as inflation. There is no such thing as inflation.
IrvineRenter_IHB
New member
I looks like the Democrats are hoping to systematically dismantle every vestige of the "ownership society."
This will cause a great deal of money not to flow into stocks and bonds. If they pass this, the market recovery will take forever. One of the societal advantages of the 401K is that it had many people investing in the economic growth of our country. Instead I guess this money will flow into government coffers where it can be invested in government bonds and finance our own debt.
This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
This will cause a great deal of money not to flow into stocks and bonds. If they pass this, the market recovery will take forever. One of the societal advantages of the 401K is that it had many people investing in the economic growth of our country. Instead I guess this money will flow into government coffers where it can be invested in government bonds and finance our own debt.
This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
[quote author="skek" date=1224910013][quote author="IrvineRenter" date=1224909036]I looks like the Democrats are hoping to systematically dismantle every vestige of the "ownership society."
This will cause a great deal of money not to flow into stocks and bonds. If they pass this, the market recovery will take forever. One of the societal advantages of the 401K is that it had many people investing in the economic growth of our country. Instead I guess this money will flow into government coffers where it can be invested in government bonds and finance our own debt.
This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.</blockquote>
Just in time for Halloween, every frightening half-baked idea in Washington is suddenly coming out of the shadows and being taken seriously. Massive bailouts? OK. Government ownership of banks? No problem. Subsidized loans to industry? Yep. Rewriting private contracts (mortgages)? You betcha. Government takeover of 401k's? Why not!
And to be clear, these ideas are coming from all ends of the political spectrum. Both parties have lost their bearings. Well, maybe the Republicans have lost their bearings and the Democrats are just telling us what they've always <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niJAkR_6tKQ">really wanted to do...</a></blockquote>
I feel like screaming "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore" just like that movie Network that was released in the 70s/80s
This will cause a great deal of money not to flow into stocks and bonds. If they pass this, the market recovery will take forever. One of the societal advantages of the 401K is that it had many people investing in the economic growth of our country. Instead I guess this money will flow into government coffers where it can be invested in government bonds and finance our own debt.
This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.</blockquote>
Just in time for Halloween, every frightening half-baked idea in Washington is suddenly coming out of the shadows and being taken seriously. Massive bailouts? OK. Government ownership of banks? No problem. Subsidized loans to industry? Yep. Rewriting private contracts (mortgages)? You betcha. Government takeover of 401k's? Why not!
And to be clear, these ideas are coming from all ends of the political spectrum. Both parties have lost their bearings. Well, maybe the Republicans have lost their bearings and the Democrats are just telling us what they've always <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niJAkR_6tKQ">really wanted to do...</a></blockquote>
I feel like screaming "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore" just like that movie Network that was released in the 70s/80s
acpme_IHB
New member
i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
[quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.
[quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224914882][quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
[quote author="WINEX" date=1224916505][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224914882][quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.
[quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224918322][quote author="WINEX" date=1224916505][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224914882][quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
<blockquote>Public discussion about the financial health
of Social Security usually focuses on the longrun
solvency of the system. Solvency is determined
either by the year the actuaries estimate
the trust fund will be exhausted (at present,
2038) or by the cumulated difference between
Social Security receipts and benefit outlays
over the next 70 years (at present, a shortfall of
25 percent of benefits).</blockquote>
<a href="http://www.cato.org/pubs/ssps/ssp26.pdf">http://www.cato.org/pubs/ssps/ssp26.pdf</a>
of Social Security usually focuses on the longrun
solvency of the system. Solvency is determined
either by the year the actuaries estimate
the trust fund will be exhausted (at present,
2038) or by the cumulated difference between
Social Security receipts and benefit outlays
over the next 70 years (at present, a shortfall of
25 percent of benefits).</blockquote>
<a href="http://www.cato.org/pubs/ssps/ssp26.pdf">http://www.cato.org/pubs/ssps/ssp26.pdf</a>
WestparkRenter_IHB
New member
[quote author="WINEX" date=1224918930][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224918322][quote author="WINEX" date=1224916505][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224914882][quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.</blockquote>
I said you can expect nothing but that is not reality. See the above post. Was it too far over your head too?
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.</blockquote>
I said you can expect nothing but that is not reality. See the above post. Was it too far over your head too?
jbenko_IHB
New member
I love stocks and the stock market, but I have yet to contribute a single penny to a 401K. I don't see it as a good rate of return based on the limitations you have investing.
Also, if you have 1,000,000 in your 401K right now you probably already lost 300K and expect to have less or about the same 10 years from now. A gigantic waste.
These days you have cycle your equities whenever possible and be able to play defense when possible. 401ks don't let you do that.
Also, if you have 1,000,000 in your 401K right now you probably already lost 300K and expect to have less or about the same 10 years from now. A gigantic waste.
These days you have cycle your equities whenever possible and be able to play defense when possible. 401ks don't let you do that.
[quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1225001807][quote author="WINEX" date=1224918930][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224918322][quote author="WINEX" date=1224916505][quote author="WestparkRenter" date=1224914882][quote author="acpme" date=1224913181]i have pretty much accepted the fact that the SS taxes i pay are basically a give-away to the govt. i'm not counting on seeing that money ever again nor am i relying on it when considering my retirement. on top of that i max my 401k because i know whatever i need for retirement i'm going to need to build on my own -- SS isn't going to cut it, if there's even something left in my old age. so i take the big sacrifice in my paycheck, and now the gubment wants to screw with that too???
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.</blockquote>
I said you can expect nothing but that is not reality. See the above post. Was it too far over your head too?</blockquote>
Apparently the subject is too far over your head.
Social Security doesn't have a "trust fund". Benefits are paid out from current receipts. Anything left over is borrowed by Congress and doesn't officially appear on the budget deficit. Because of retirements of the Baby Boom generation and the smaller pool of workers that will be supporting them, excess Social Security receipts will disappear within the next 10 years. At that point in time, paying out Social Security payments will increase the budget deficit.
Don't expect it to last. Ponzi schemes always collapse.
this idea is wtf level and pretty much guarantees the financial health of americans in the future will be dire. most americans already are far behind in their necessary savings needed for retirement, personal savings rate is zilch, SS is going to go broke, and existing 401ks just took a nice 40% dive in the past month. i already know far too many of my peers who aren't taking advantage of their 401k. now let's get rid the only reason left for americans to save and make panda's prediction this nation and its people go bankrupt come true... because we all know that saving too much money is what got is in this darn mess!</blockquote>
I did a study on the SS. It's not going away, the worst case is that you only get 70% of what you expect.</blockquote>
And 70% of nothing is....</blockquote>
It's not 70% of nothing. If you normally expect around $2300/per month when you retire, you will get around $1600/per month, which is a big discount but it's better than nothing. However, it's best not to count on it.</blockquote>
Did you hear the "wooshing" sound? Or was it too far over your head.
I expect nothing. 70% of nothing is nothing.
As someone who was born in the last 6 months of the baby boom, I think my expectations are closer to reality than what you are trying to tell me what to expect.</blockquote>
I said you can expect nothing but that is not reality. See the above post. Was it too far over your head too?</blockquote>
Apparently the subject is too far over your head.
Social Security doesn't have a "trust fund". Benefits are paid out from current receipts. Anything left over is borrowed by Congress and doesn't officially appear on the budget deficit. Because of retirements of the Baby Boom generation and the smaller pool of workers that will be supporting them, excess Social Security receipts will disappear within the next 10 years. At that point in time, paying out Social Security payments will increase the budget deficit.
Don't expect it to last. Ponzi schemes always collapse.